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As we get deep into playtesting the new rules, I want to suggest that the new generic rule system be called "P20" and have "Pathfinder" be for the Pathfinder Society of Golarion and other world-specific products.
d20 was a recognized identity linked to D&D 3.5. P20 shows continuity with change, evolution. Audibly, it sounds similar but now the P stands for Paizo and Pathfinder. Visually, use a purple die to replaces the red one - similar, yet different (this suggestion was partly inspired by the really cool purple Paizo d20 I just bought). And the "P" looks like a "d" turned on its head, rotated 180 degrees, or whatever other cute little slogan you want to use.
Also important, if another company who wants to use the system, they don't have to use the word Pathfinder on their product because that word is so closely tied to Golarion. What if a company wanted to do a modern game with the rules, they would have to say "Modern Marvels, using the Pathfinder system" - that makes me wonder if it is a game set in a modern Golarion.
Keep the name Pathfinder for the Paizo/Golarion stuff and call the new rule system P20. That's how much I like this little purple die.
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This is a clever idea! - Kudos
I will say this - Pathfinder covers tooo much. It is a role playing game... Pathfinder = D&D. It is a Campaign setting... Pathfinder = Forgotten Realms. It is an organized play group... Pathfinder = Living Greyhawk. Plus it is a series of adventure paths and stand alone (and linked) modules. Oh yeah and a set of fiction stories.
I'm all for brand id... but it gets confusing. Especially with the differences between d20 and P20 (disconnects between the campaign setting and the PFRPG, ie clerical domain benefits). It took me a while to figure out what was what.
The P20 idea is a brilliant way to help create some seperation.
Creative Director
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This is a cute idea, but separation isn't what we want. Feedback from our distributors and stores tells us that the "Pathfinder" brand has generated traction... a lot of it. Way more than the "GameMastery" brand did, to the extent that we can sell more modules now that they're "Pathfinder" modules instead of "GameMastery" ones. Calling the core rules P20 is cute, but it resets our presence in stores and among distributors to zero. After being pretty successful at building the "Pathfinder" brand over the past 2 years or so, it'd be way too risky to change that branding for a release as important as the Pathfinder RPG. The name of the game is writ in stone, in other words.
While re-branding is out of the question, we could have some fun with p20 in the community. Thanks for sharing it!
PS For those who love bringing the Greek in, the name of the letter Pi is pronounced "pee" just like in English, not pie like in math class.
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Chief Technical Officer
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I will say this - Pathfinder covers tooo much. It is a role playing game... Pathfinder = D&D. It is a Campaign setting... Pathfinder = Forgotten Realms. It is an organized play group... Pathfinder = Living Greyhawk. Plus it is a series of adventure paths and stand alone (and linked) modules. Oh yeah and a set of fiction stories.
The Pathfinder brand encompasses all of those things, but Pathfinder is not the actual name of any of them.
The roleplaying game is the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game.
The campaign setting is the Pathfinder Chronicles campaign setting, and support books for the setting bear the Pathfinder Chronicles logo.
The organized play group is the Pathfinder Society.
The monthly adventure path product is the Pathfinder Adventure Path.
The modules are the Pathfinder Modules.
If you're referring to the fiction stories in the AP volumes, those are the Pathfinder's Journal.
The bimonthly player-oriented book is the Pathfinder Companion.
So the Pathfinder brand ties all of these things together, but none of these things are just called "Pathfinder."
And to be clear, third-party publishers who produce products for use with the Pathfinder RPG under our forthcoming Pathfinder Roleplaying Game compatibility license won't be allowed to call them "Pathfinder" anything, and they won't be able to place them in the Pathfinder Chronicles campaign setting, though they will be able to place a logo on the product that indicates that it's "compatible with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game."
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Chief Technical Officer
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If third party publishers cannot use Pathfinder in way what do they use? Previously you could use d20 or OGL. Can't use d20 anymore. So would OGL still be what is used?
Sort of like OGL compatible with the PRPG?
The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game is published under the Open Game License; to use Pathfinder RPG content, publishers also must publish under the OGL. However, the OGL prohibits indicating compatibility using trademarks of another company without a license; our Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License will solve that problem.
So if your question is what license they use to create a product compatible with the Pathfinder RPG, the answer is "both the OGL and the Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License" (unless, for some reason, they don't *want* to indicate compatibility with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, in which case they can just use the OGL).
If your question is how they indicate that on their products, the answer is that the Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License will allow them to place a logo on the product that indicates that it's "Compatible with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game." (We'll be unveiling this logo along with the license itself early in 2009.) If they want to also indicate compatibility with the 3.5 SRD, or anything else, that's up to them; it's not mandated by either the OGL or the Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License.
The Pathfinder brand encompasses all of those things, but Pathfinder is not the actual name of any of them.
The roleplaying game is the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game.
The campaign setting is the Pathfinder Chronicles campaign setting, and support books for the setting bear the Pathfinder Chronicles logo.
The organized play group is the Pathfinder Society.
The monthly adventure path product is the Pathfinder Adventure Path.
The modules are the Pathfinder Modules.
If you're referring to the fiction stories in the AP volumes, those are the Pathfinder's Journal.
The bimonthly player-oriented book is the Pathfinder Companion.So the Pathfinder brand ties all of these things together, but none of these things are just called "Pathfinder."
And to be clear, third-party publishers who produce products for use with the Pathfinder RPG under our forthcoming Pathfinder Roleplaying Game compatibility license won't be allowed to call them "Pathfinder" anything, and they won't be able to place them in the Pathfinder Chronicles campaign setting, though they will be able to place a logo on the product that indicates that it's "compatible with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game."
I thought OP's original idea about p20 was nice, but you make a convincing case that it is a bad idea from the marketing point of view.
Nevertheless, may I make a suggestion of my own? Perhaps the Game Master could be called Path Master in the Pathfinder RPG. It would be a neat touch and the name is logically sound too (at least as much as Dungeon Master). The abbreviation, PM, evokes 'personal message', but such short abbreviations always have multiple meanings anyway, for example: GM = General Motors and DM = Display Manager.
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If your question is how they indicate that on their products, the answer is that the Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License will allow them to place a logo on the product that indicates that it's "Compatible with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game." (We'll be unveiling this logo along with the license itself early in 2009.)
A little purple die that says P20????? :)
And to be clear, third-party publishers...they will be able to place a logo on the product that indicates that it's "compatible with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game."
The OP's idea would be cool for this logo.
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Nevertheless, may I make a suggestion of my own? Perhaps the Game Master could be called Path Master in the Pathfinder RPG. It would be a neat touch and the name is logically sound too (at least as much as Dungeon Master). The abbreviation, PM, evokes 'personal message', but such short abbreviations always have multiple meanings anyway, for example: GM = General Motors and DM = Display Manager.
So,...I could be... Prime Minister?
Cool.
Nevertheless, may I make a suggestion of my own? Perhaps the Game Master could be called Path Master in the Pathfinder RPG. It would be a neat touch and the name is logically sound too (at least as much as Dungeon Master). The abbreviation, PM, evokes 'personal message', but such short abbreviations always have multiple meanings anyway, for example: GM = General Motors and DM = Display Manager.So,...I could be... Prime Minister?
Cool.
:D
PM = Path Master
PM = Personal Message
PM = Prime Minister
GM = Game Master
GM = General Motors
GM = General Manager
GM = Genetically Modified
Yeah, short abbreviations can take on multiple meanings. :D