Eldritch Knight - Prerequisites & Dead Levels


Prestige Classes


I have always loved the idea of a Fighter / Mage type character, but was left a little flat with the Eldritch Knight in 3.5. Paizo has done a great job in revitializing it, but it still has too many dead levels. On another thread, a poster Majuba suggested these new requirements to enter the Prestige Class :

Base Attack Bonus : +4
Spells : Must be able to Cast 2nd Level Arcane Spells
Special : Must be proficient with All Martial Weapons

I think these requirements are much better, allowing a fighter 3 / Wizard 3 or sorcerer 4 progression to qualify.

Now, as for the dead levels, here are my suggestions :

Arcane Aegis ( Su ) : At 2nd Level, any time the Eldritch Knight casts an Abjuration Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC, he can increase the value of the Bonus by +1. This Bonus increases every 2 Levels ( +2 at 4th Level, +3 at 6th Level, +4 at 8th Level and finally +5 at 10th Level. ).

Arcane Smite : At 4th Level, an Eldritch Knight can use a Standard Action to cast any Touch Spell he knows and can deliver the Spell through his weapon with a melee attack. Casting a Spell in this manner does not provoke an Attack of Opportunity. The Spell must have a Casting Time of 1 Standard Action or less. If the melee attack is successful, the attack deals Damage normally, then the effect of the Spell is resolved. Doing so discharges the Spell at the end of the Round, in the case of a Touch Spell that would otherwise last longer than 1 Round.

Extended Aegis ( Su ) : At 6th Level, the Eldritch Knight doubles the Duration of any Abjuration Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC, as if he applied the Extend Spell Metamagic Feat to them ( but without any change in Level or Casting time ).

Swift Aegis ( Su ) : Beginning at 8th Level, the Eldritch Knight can cast any Abjuration Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC as a Swift Action, as if he had applied the Quicken Spell Metamagic Feat to them ( but without any change in level ). The Maximum Level of Spell you can Quicken in this way is equal to ½ your Class Level
( Rounded up ).

This leaves only 2 dead levels and allows the eldritch Knight much needed armor capabilities in the form of Improved Mage Armor and Shield type Spells, and one good offensive ability in the Arcane Smite.

What do you all think ?


Bladesinger wrote:

I have always loved the idea of a Fighter / Mage type character, but was left a little flat with the Eldritch Knight in 3.5. Paizo has done a great job in revitializing it, but it still has too many dead levels. On another thread, a poster Majuba suggested these new requirements to enter the Prestige Class :

Base Attack Bonus : +4
Spells : Must be able to Cast 2nd Level Arcane Spells
Special : Must be proficient with All Martial Weapons

I think these requirements are much better, allowing a fighter 3 / Wizard 3 or sorcerer 4 progression to qualify.

Now, as for the dead levels, here are my suggestions :

Arcane Aegis ( Su ) : At 2nd Level, any time the Eldritch Knight casts an Abjuration Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC, he can increase the value of the Bonus by +1. This Bonus increases every 2 Levels ( +2 at 4th Level, +3 at 6th Level, +4 at 8th Level and finally +5 at 10th Level. ).

Arcane Smite : At 4th Level, an Eldritch Knight can use a Standard Action to cast any Touch Spell he knows and can deliver the Spell through his weapon with a melee attack. Casting a Spell in this manner does not provoke an Attack of Opportunity. The Spell must have a Casting Time of 1 Standard Action or less. If the melee attack is successful, the attack deals Damage normally, then the effect of the Spell is resolved. Doing so discharges the Spell at the end of the Round, in the case of a Touch Spell that would otherwise last longer than 1 Round.

Extended Aegis ( Su ) : At 6th Level, the Eldritch Knight doubles the Duration of any Abjuration Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC, as if he applied the Extend Spell Metamagic Feat to them ( but without any change in Level or Casting time ).

Swift Aegis ( Su ) : Beginning at 8th Level, the Eldritch Knight can cast any Abjuration Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC as a Swift Action, as if he had applied the Quicken Spell Metamagic Feat to them ( but without any change in level ). The Maximum Level of Spell you can Quicken in...

Well somebody starts to think about the EK. I'd like the abilities for the dead levels. He reminds me the spellsword, but the arcane smite only works with touch spells.

Scarab Sages

I like the adjusted Requirements.
I think that this is too heavily biased twards benefiting abjurers, but this feels like a good direction. I'd prefer if this were one of several options. I think of it as the Aegis Option. a Gladius option for evokers, etc, would flesh this out quite a bit.


Why the arcane trickster have a good will save and a +1 spellcaster level and no the Eldritch Knight?


I like these suggestions.

Jason's version of the Eldritch Knight got a much needed boost to hit points, and many new flavor abilities. However, despite these boosts, the EK still feels subpar, especially when compared to the fighter and pure casters.

I'd recommend looking at the Duskblade base class from Player's Handbook 2, and the Spellsword prestige class from Complete Warrior for ideas to increase the effectiveness of this class.

Though some discretion is needed when considering new features. The Eldritch Knight should never outshine a fighter in pure physical combat or a sorcerer/wizard in terms of pure casting.

Like the wonderful suggestions made by the original poster, any new abilities need to increase the EK's unique ability to blend warfare and magic into one fluid art.


guille f wrote:
Why does the arcane trickster have a good will save and a +1 spellcaster level and not the Eldritch Knight?

Primarily because the Arcane Trickster has higher prerequisites, requiring more non-casting levels. Also the full BAB of the Eldritch Knight is one of the few resources that is very hard to acquire elsewhere (for purposes of iterative attacks, feat prereqs, etc.)

As to the Original topic, I mostly agree with Matthew above. I think the Eldritch Knight is pretty well balanced as is, but a touch more might help (perhaps at 3rd and 7th). I do think any new abilities need to be school neutral as this class is intended for the *generic* Fighter/Wizard type. Abjuration powers are great, unless you happen to have it as an anti-school, or simply don't use Mage Armor/Shield type spells (Bard/Eldritch Knights for instance).

Scarab Sages

Spell Failure: Reduce arcane spell failure chances in armor by, say, 2% per level.

Loading: Allow an Eldrich knight to load spells into their weapons (ala spell storing), armor, or shields, which go off when a successful hit is made, when they get hit, or either for shields, respectively.

Arcane Bonds: Allow them to gain additional item arcane bonds.


I was going to say that I liked the OP's first two ideas, Arcane Aegis and Arcane Smite, but that I thought the last two abilities, Extended Aegis and Swift Aegis, unfairly stepped on the toes of the abjurer. However, DivineAspect already commented on the same problem from another angle (bias in favor of abjurers), and I liked Majuba's point about EK abilities being school neutral. Still, I like Arcane Aegis, and I think it remains a good idea, since not all defensive spells are abjurations. For example, mage armor is a conjuration with the [force] descriptor.

The loading idea was an interesting way to make Arcane Smite do more than deliver touch spells:

DivineAspect wrote:


Loading: Allow an Eldrich knight to load spells into their weapons (ala spell storing), armor, or shields, which go off when a successful hit is made, when they get hit, or either for shields, respectively.

The "when they get hit" contingency seems a little too good, and it made me wonder: Why can't wizards do that? Actually they can, but it's a 6th level spell (contingency; the 4th level fire shield also works, but it has been scaled back since 1e). So I agree it's cool, but the ability to do damage when it's not your turn should probably be handled with care.

I do think this PrC is just asking for some way to deliver spells with a melee weapon. The capstone Spell Critical does the job, but it would be nice to have something along these lines at a low level as well. Combining the damage of a melee weapon and a touch spell may be overpowered, but maybe we could do something like the Arcane Archer's enhance arrows (elemental), or else let only descriptors and status effects of touch spells stack with weapon damage, or let only the non-variable portion of the spell's damage stack, something like that.


DivineAspect wrote:

I like the adjusted Requirements.

I think that this is too heavily biased twards benefiting abjurers, but this feels like a good direction. I'd prefer if this were one of several options. I think of it as the Aegis Option. a Gladius option for evokers, etc, would flesh this out quite a bit.

Actually, I wasn't leaning on it being biased towards any Specialist, but looking at it from the perspective of rather than giving them armor to wear, they would rely on Mage Armor [ which is a Conjuration Spell, btw, not Abjuration, so the wording of the Arcane Aegis ability needs to be re-worked. ] and Shield Spells, instead of regular Armor and risking a Spell Failure chance, or expending Feats when they have perfectly good Spells to blend with their fighting. Extended and Swift Aegis were put in there to allow them to " wear " their Armor all day long, if need be, and to Armor themselves quickly for a battle, nothing more.

Also, my inspirations for this were from the Duskblade and Spellsword, as well as 4th Edition's Swordmage Class ( Yes, I know, I've said a dirty word, LOL ).

Edited for Clarity :

Arcane Aegis ( Su ) : At 2nd Level, any time the Eldritch Knight casts a Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC, he can increase the value of the Bonus by +1. This Bonus increases every 2 Levels ( +2 at 4th Level, +3 at 6th Level, +4 at 8th Level and finally +5 at 10th Level. ).

Extended Aegis ( Su ) : At 6th Level, the Eldritch Knight doubles the Duration of any Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC, as if he applied the Extend Spell Metamagic Feat to them ( but without any change in Level or Casting time ).

Swift Aegis ( Su ) : Beginning at 8th Level, the Eldritch Knight can cast any Spell that grants an Armor or Shield Bonus to AC as a Swift Action, as if he had applied the Quicken Spell Metamagic Feat to them ( but without any change in level ). The Maximum Level of Spell you can Quicken in this way is equal to ½ your Class Level ( Rounded up ).

The " Loading " ability is similar to a Prestige Class called, strangly enough, Eldritch Warrior from Monte Cook's Complete Book of Eldritch Might. I've seen it in play and have to say, its not as impressive as it sounds. The Arcane Smite comes from the Duskblade ability called Arcane Channeling, or the Smiting Spell Metamagic Feat from PHB II. It is a good abiltiy that I have seen used very effectively.


Perhaps I am missing something, but I hardly call any level with full BAB and FULL Spell casting a Dead level.

If any level is a dead level its level 1, not level 2 though 10.


While both spellcasting and BaB at almost every level is good, it's not as much fun. Attacks and spells are two separate things unless you buff yourself or debuff your opponent. The real fun is the synergy between the two classes, which I think comes with some of the ideas posted here.

I agree that some sort of weapon channeling should be part of this class. There are a few options you can add (which I've posted elsewhere:

Spell Failure reduction from armor (Duskblade and Spellsword)
A Sudden Quicken option at higher levels (a la Duskblade)
An ability to convert spells to bonuses (attack, saves, etc) (Jade Phoenix Mage and Abjurant Champion)

I think the Spell Failure reduction would be pretty sensible, but the other two would have to be considered *major* class features, perhaps even replacing the bonus Feats. I do think that the "spells to bonuses" ability is the ultimate synergy for this class, I think it's *really* powerful.

Weapon Channeling: I think this is the big favorite, and to carry a theme from the Feats and Skills playtest, perhaps more opportunities to channel a spell could fill in those dead levels? Perhaps the ability to channel a spell on an AoO?

Finally (I know this is long), I think that with any PrC, you can allow the option for your school power to continue to class up with you.

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