I feel the druids need a healing boost so parties without a new cleric can actually heal themselves.
This way druid becomes a NPC class, that is only taken by the average party if one cleric is in the party already.
Clerics now have a instantaneous healing burst ability so I would suggest to give Druids fast healing per round ability.
They could heal 1 hp per 2 class levels for number of rounds equal to their Charisma modifier. Also they can use this ability for 3+Cha modifier times per day.
Also evil druids can after a successful melee touch attack do poison damage per round instead of healing with a save for half duration.
This makes the mechanic similar to Channel Energy. Some feats could be invented for this ability then.
The Druid does a fine job of healing right now.
Except for Reincarnate. That spell needs a complete overhaul.
Is this new ability going to take the place of Wildshape or the Animal Companion?
It's a little frustrating seeing everyone demanding amazing new powers at every turn. The druid has plenty of Ooomph.
The Paladin got a serious boost in his healing capabilities so that gives the party a little flexibility on that front. I wouldn't mind seeing the druid's Cure X healing spells all move to equivalent cleric levels which would help. Also, I'm house ruling that a druid can take the healing domain instead of the AC or other domain... not that I expect anyone will ever use it.
I need to ask. Why is the druid a healer? A paladin and even a bard are healers the druid as a healer is a 3e add on and it really does not fit the class
I wouldn't mind seeing the druid's Cure X healing spells all move to equivalent cleric levels which would help. Also, I'm house ruling that a druid can take the healing domain instead of the AC or other domain... not that I expect anyone will ever use it.
I agree.
I need to ask. Why is the druid a healer? A paladin and even a bard are healers the druid as a healer is a 3e add on and it really does not fit the class
Druids have been the second best healers since AD&D. Granted it was a distant second (CLW was a second level spell) even then but they have always had that role. It's kind of strange though... a high CHA paladin might be a better healer than a druid now. I'm not sure how I feel about that.
In fiction 'druid' type characters often have a lot of knowledge about healing due to the work they do with animals.
Druids are no worse off than they've always been.
If you want to shoe-horn your druid into a healer, they still suck at it. They always sucked at it- but the comparison wasn't as bad. Now the distinction has been made more clear.
If you want to play a primary healer, the druid isn't for you.
Buffing the druid should take the form of making the druid a better druid, not a better cleric.
-S
I agree that the druid should not be the second healer. This guy must be the paladin.
However, as pointed on another thread with much debate and people demanding that only people that agreed with the OP posted on the topic, the druid just sucks if he even try to heal. He must be a druid, no wasting his time trying to do what the cleric does best.
However, I woul LOVE the CHANCE of being a little better at healing. Not making the druid better by default, but just giving him this choice if he ever wants it. Maybe a pacifist druid or something like that (please, no need about the "nature is cruel thing", let's think about a unicorn-like druid, without the Horn and the Hooves. Maybe with the hooves.) could choose an ability that helped healing. Maybe something you could choose in the place of animal companion or wildshape.
Maybe just the option of being able to use the healing domain.
Not anything great: With this option he should be as good at healing as a cleric who cares not for healing.
But then, there could be more happiness in the universe (and in the happy-flores-of-the-good-druid).
Druids are no worse off than they've always been.
If you want to shoe-horn your druid into a healer, they still suck at it. They always sucked at it- but the comparison wasn't as bad. Now the distinction has been made more clear.
If you want to play a primary healer, the druid isn't for you.
Buffing the druid should take the form of making the druid a better druid, not a better cleric.
-S
WHAT?
Lets take a look over the pass 30 years?
AD&D (1st Edition)
Druid was a subclass of cleric.
CLW is a cleric 1st level spell and a druid 2nd level spell.
CSW is a 4th level spell for both classes.
CCW is a cleric 5th level spell and a druid 6th level spell
But wait…
Druid got the spell levels earlier. They got 2nd level spells at 2nd level where a cleric had to wait until 3rd.
So over all they are slightly behind.
2nd edition AD&D
Druid was a subclass of cleric.
Clerics included druids got their spells list by spheres. Spheres are 2nd edition of domains.
Druid got the Healing sphere; therefore they had the same healing as cleric.
3rd D&D
Druid are 63% healing potential that a cleric. See my other posts.
PFRPG
Druid are 38% healing potential that a cleric. See my other posts.
I am not saying the druids NEED to have their healing boosted and all their powers as they are currently, but the history is that have been the 2nd best healer for ALL of the game history.
My option is remove the AC or give them Ranger’s AC and give them one domain. Add the healing domain to their list.
Druids are no worse off than they've always been.
If you want to shoe-horn your druid into a healer, they still suck at it. They always sucked at it- but the comparison wasn't as bad. Now the distinction has been made more clear.
If you want to play a primary healer, the druid isn't for you.
Buffing the druid should take the form of making the druid a better druid, not a better cleric.
-S
WHAT?
Lets take a look over the pass 30 years?
AD&D (1st Edition)
Druid was a subclass of cleric.
CLW is a cleric 1st level spell and a druid 2nd level spell.
CSW is a 4th level spell for both classes.
CCW is a cleric 5th level spell and a druid 6th level spell
But wait…
Druid got the spell levels earlier. They got 2nd level spells at 2nd level where a cleric had to wait until 3rd.
So over all they are slightly behind.2nd edition AD&D
Druid was a subclass of cleric.
Clerics included druids got their spells list by spheres. Spheres are 2nd edition of domains.
Druid got the Healing sphere; therefore they had the same healing as cleric.3rd D&D
Druid are 63% healing potential that a cleric. See my other posts.PFRPG
Druid are 38% healing potential that a cleric. See my other posts.I am not saying the druids NEED to have their healing boosted and all their powers as they are currently, but the history is that have been the 2nd best healer for ALL of the game history.
My option is remove the AC or give them Ranger’s AC and give them one domain. Add the healing domain to their list.
Again, Sannos, I find myself quite pleased and impressed by your command of the facts and your understanding of why this should be a topic for discussion. Your participation is very much appreciated.
I looked in the PF Beta book, In the 3.5 PH, on the SRD, and the 3e PH. Beta and srd have no description for the class. 3 and 3.5 use the same description.
While it does not say that the druid should be a healing class it stresses that there is a duality, both to nature and it's servants. The sentiment (p33PH3.5) is perhaps best expressed by the sentence "The fury of a storm, the gentle strength of the morning sun" further evidence that druids are not all intended to hate and destroy (but can when someone disses mama nature).
However, on the following page, it says clearly that the Druid "Lacks the healing power of the cleric" and functions best in a platoon healing role with Paladin being the given example. Versatility is the druid's intended role, and it is arguable that healing is part of that versatility and has been since the advent of the game.
If someone wants to play a druid who embodies that gentler side of nature, and it seems that there are as many of us that do as there are what don't, then they should be able to. I personally would need to be well convinced that this was going to contribute to an imbalance or power creep.
As I said elsewhere, I think that much of this can be solved when we look at feats and spells, but I do agree that adding the healing domain to the available options is an elegant and complete solution, perhaps helping the druid to achieve their versatility support role without overpowering them and especially because it is really seperate, in a way from the other argument(s) about druids and their balance vs. other classes.
I wouldn't object to them being able to take the Healing Domain.
I'm glad to see that someone other than myself sees that there is a discrepancy in healing in the game presented by the cleric's new found powers. I am not sure at this point if the solution is to give the druid more healing capability to keep up, or to somehow bring up the power of potions, wondrous items, wands and spells, or to add new feats or spells that can help casters of healing spells other than the cleric to catch up to the cleric, but as things stand now, DM's are going to be faced with an impossible task of balancing encounters without the foreknowledge of whether there is a cleric in the party or not.
I personally dread the possibility that a single class is going to be necessary for parties to face encounters as they are written in new modules designed for PathfinderRPG, even though I have always been a big fan of the cleric class, and when we have started new campaigns I am often heard to say 'Ok, I'm the cleric, what classes do you guys want to play?'
It is possible that the solution may have to be that the cleric loses the channel energy ability, which would make me sad, but I would understand. The reason I think this may end up having to be the solution is that the complexity of balancing the other healing classes against this new power may end up being too involved and take up too much of the designers' time compared to the relatively simple solution of lowering the cleric's healing abilities to their original level.
I have been play-testing the cleric since the release of alpha-1, and although it took me quite a while to get past my own enjoyment of channel energy to admit it to myself, I have to admit that as things stand now, it is unbalancing to the game. It is making the DM's job too difficult - not that the DM's job is to kill the players, but it is to present the players with challenges that are potentially deadly and take skill to overcome.
I see the discrepancy. The issue is whether or not it's something that needs to be fixed. That, we seem to disagree on.
You are absolutely right in that they are sub-par healers compared to clerics. In exchange they get a cohort, the ability to take on nearly any useful form in the game, and *full spell casting*. They are a very excellent combat oriented class.
They do not Also be on par with, or just 2nd fiddle to, the cleric in terms of healing. I have nothing personal against the druid- but they really, really aren't a class that needs to be buffed.
-S
I wouldn't object to them being able to take the Healing Domain.
After speaking with my colleagues this weekend, I'm going to have to withdraw my agreement with this suggestion - their 8th and 20th level abilities are simply too good. Druids should NOT get Mass Heal. It's appropriate for Clerics - not for Druids.