PCs: putting your best face forward


General Discussion (Prerelease)


Back in the 1st/2nd edition days, the spokesperson of an adventuring group was whichever character had the highest charisma score. The 'face' of the team could just as easily be a Fighter as a Paladin, Cleric, or Bard.

With 3.x this has changed. I like the skills system, but I have never warmed to the fact that the best way a Fighter can influence people is now by growling at them until they knuckle under. I understand that a Paladin would likely have better training in etiquette than a common Fighter, but I personally think that good manners and persuasive speech should be available to all characters at full ranks (except, perhaps, Barbarians).


QXL99 wrote:

Back in the 1st/2nd edition days, the spokesperson of an adventuring group was whichever character had the highest charisma score. The 'face' of the team could just as easily be a Fighter as a Paladin, Cleric, or Bard.

With 3.x this has changed. I like the skills system, but I have never warmed to the fact that the best way a Fighter can influence people is now by growling at them until they knuckle under. I understand that a Paladin would likely have better training in etiquette than a common Fighter, but I personally think that good manners and persuasive speech should be available to all characters at full ranks (except, perhaps, Barbarians).

The Diplomacy skill (and every other skill, for that matter) is available to all characters at full ranks in Pathfinder. The only difference between a fighter and a paladin with maxed-out Diplomacy is that the paladin gets a +3 bonus for having Diplomacy as a class skill.

Liberty's Edge

QXL99 wrote:
...I personally think that good manners and persuasive speech should be available to all characters at full ranks

They are. Even the barbarian can spend X skill points to get X ranks of Diplomacy. Fighters and barbarians aren't penalized for trying to be diplomatic; they're just not rewarded for doing it.

The difference between "penalized" and "not rewarded" is a significant one. Yes, a fighter can max out Diplomacy and be pretty good at it, but the paladin with maxed out Diplomacy will be better at it. Being a paladin or a cleric lends itself to diplomacy. Being highly trained in killing things doesn't (although it does for Intimidate!).

Long story short, don't think of it as "Fighters suck at Diplomacy," think of it as "Paladins are better than average at Diplomacy."

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