Creative Director
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Vreeg's Chamber says it's an EL 7, but the CR for Vreeg says CR 6. Which one would be correct? I'd have thought that with a base derro being a CR 3, that a level 5 wizard derro would be at least a 7, maybe an 8. He did give the party quite the go-over.
Anyone know for sure? Thanks!
Vreeg's correct CR is 6. but he's a "high" CR 6. The EL of his room should be 6, but since he's kinda tough, EL 7 is a handy way to say "he's a little tougher than normal...". If he worked your party over, ret-conning him to CR 7 to get the PCs a little more XP is cool.
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Thanks James. It didn't help that the party only had a couple people that could do ranged damage (the scout and wizard), and the scout got Ghoul Touched almost instantly. With him flying around and having a high touch and normal AC, it was definitely a tough fight, so 7 sounds good.
Though the player of the scout (a gambler in the game) is now obsessed with finding out the rules to Rat Squish, despite that the derro are mad and it probably didn't have any rules. :) I wanted to thank you and the Paizo staff personally for little things like that which make the game just plain awesome.
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It was a great fight. I just ran it.
The PC's were out of spells. (Except for the wizard, Beta rules, acid dart.) They all got down to below 5 hp's and the Paladin ended up being blinded. Overall pretty awesome.
Worked up his spellbook:
Link.
We just finished the first book last Friday and the battle with Vreeg took about 15 rounds, not including an earlier encounter when he cast darkness on the players in the bedroom next door.
Now I'm off for two sessions so I can recharge, prepare for the next book, and play a Half-Orc druid in a one-shot.
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I added Ghoul Glyphs from the Spell Compendium to his bag of tricks, and plotted two points for them near the entrance to his room (leaving a small entryway for his added familiar "Unsquishable" and Rolth to come and go). However, after much of the party was dazed and paralyzed by the lesser necrophidii in our most recent session, I might ease up on the immobilizing effects. It was dicey. The sound burst in an earlier encounter with the derro also stunned two party members for a round, so.... Vreeg should be a nice capstone challenge for the awesome start to our campaign.
With him flying around and having a high touch and normal AC, it was definitely a tough fight, so 7 sounds good.
I just ran this encounter last night and had a bit of a problem. Vreeg is in a small room (25' x 15') and while I can't find a specific mention of the room's height, it seems a bit of a stretch for the height to be enough to make Fly a tactical advantage. Sure if he was in a large vault-like chamber, but he's in a bedroom. Even though he is small, is that enough to make melee attacks against him by tall characters impractical? (the fighter is 6'2", the half-orc cleric 6'5")
Wondered if anybody else handled this differently.
Vreeg was still pretty tough--but there was no danger of a TPK.
With him flying around and having a high touch and normal AC, it was definitely a tough fight, so 7 sounds good.I just ran this encounter last night and had a bit of a problem. Vreeg is in a small room (25' x 15') and while I can't find a specific mention of the room's height, it seems a bit of a stretch for the height to be enough to make Fly a tactical advantage. Sure if he was in a large vault-like chamber, but he's in a bedroom. Even though he is small, is that enough to make melee attacks against him by tall characters impractical? (the fighter is 6'2", the half-orc cleric 6'5")
Wondered if anybody else handled this differently.
Vreeg was still pretty tough--but there was no danger of a TPK.
I have that same issue too. How high is the ceiling in this room? If the ceiling isn't over 10', then Vreeg is a pinata for the PCs to play with.
Vreeg has a wisdom of 3. He is not very good at finding people if they run. Also, if he ever ends up in close quarters, say, just outside the tunnel to theroom he lives in, he is grapple meat. Until my players figured that out, they couldn't touch him.