Some ideas for a fighter fix.


Races & Classes


Basically, I was working on a project to "rebalance" the Core classes in D&D awhile back, and then I realized it was pointless, so I stopped. However, I had the work saved, and the second class that I worked on was the fighter. Allow me to show you what I did--and before anyone b#@*#es that the stances are Tome of Battle, I would like to say that I was working on this prior to the publication of ToB. Also, I've no idea if this is actually balanced, as I never got to playtest/tweak it...but I figured that the ideas might help the Pathfinder developers.

Combat Style (Ex)

At 1st level, a fighter must select one of several combat styles to pursue. This choice affects the character’s Class Features but does not restrict his selection of feats or special abilities in any way. All the bonuses given stack with those from feats that give similar bonuses or abilities, such as Weapon Focus or Weapon Specialization.

Archery
If the fighter chooses the archery combat style, he gains a +2 bonus on to-hit and damage rolls when within 30 feet of a target. In addition, his ranged weapons have their base range increments multiplied by 1.5.

One-Handed Fighting
If the fighter chooses the one-handed fighting combat style, any light, heavy, or tower shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 1, but only when the fighter wields a shield in one hand and a melee weapon in the other. (If he wishes, he may use a second shield as a melee weapon for this purpose, and making a shield bash does not disqualify him from this bonus.) In addition, he does not take a -1 to attack rolls for using a tower shield.

Two-Handed Fighting
If the fighter chooses the two-handed fighting combat style, he gains a +1 bonus on attack rolls and a +2 bonus on damage rolls when wielding a melee weapon with two hands. He does not get this bonus when wielding a light melee weapon with two hands.

Dual-Wielding
If the fighter chooses the dual-wielding combat style, his to-hit penalties fighting with two weapons are reduced by 1 (to a minimum of 0); this applies to the additional attacks granted by feats like Improved Two-Weapon Fighting.

Combat Stance (Ex)

At 3rd level, the fighter gains access to several combat stances. Initiating a combat stance or switching to a different combat stance is a standard action.

Aggressive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +2 bonus to attack rolls and a +4 bonus to damage rolls.

Defensive
In this stance, the fighter gains DR 3/-. (This damage reduction stacks with that from other sources, such as from wearing adamantine armor.)

Evasive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +2 dodge bonus to Armor Class.

Tactical
In this stance, the fighter gains a +2 bonus on any disarm, sunder, or trip rolls. In addition, he may trip a creature up to one size category larger than he would be able to trip normally.

Improved Combat Style (Ex)

At 5th level, a fighter’s chosen combat style improves. The bonuses from improved combat style supersede those given by combat style.

Archery
If the fighter has chosen the archery combat style, he gains a +3 bonus on to-hit and damage rolls when within 60 feet of a target. The Point Blank Shot feat has its maximum distance of effect increased to 60 feet. His ranged weapons have their base range increments multiplied by 2, and the fighter applies one-half his Dexterity bonus to damage rolls when using ranged weapons.

One-Handed Fighting
If the fighter has chosen the one-handed fighting combat style, any light shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 2, any heavy shield he wields has its armor class improved by 3, and any tower shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 4, but only when he wields a shield in one hand and a melee weapon in the other. (If he wishes, he may use a second shield as a melee weapon for this purpose, and making a shield bash does not disqualify him from this bonus.) In addition, he does not take a -1 to attack rolls for using a tower shield, and he may perform a shield bash with a tower shield.

Two-Handed Fighting
If the fighter has chosen the two-handed fighting combat style, he gains a +2 bonus on attack rolls and a +4 bonus on damage rolls when wielding a melee weapon with two hands.

Dual-Wielding
If the fighter has chosen the dual-wielding combat style, his to-hit penalties to hit are reduced by 2 (to a minimum of 0); this applies to the additional attacks granted by feats like Improve Two-Weapon. Whenever he hits with two or more attacks when wielding two weapons, he automatically rends the target for 1d6+Strength modifier points of damage.

Improved Combat Stance (Ex)

At 7th level, the fighter’s combat stances improve. The bonuses and penalties given by improved combat stance supersede those given by combat stance.

Aggressive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +3 bonus on attack rolls and a +6 bonus on damage rolls. In addition, his bonus on attack rolls from charging increases to +3.

Defensive
In this stance, the fighter’s gains DR 6/-. (This damage reduction stacks with that from other sources, such as from wearing adamantine armor.)

Evasive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +4 dodge bonus to Armor Class.

Tactical
In this stance, the fighter gains a +4 bonus on any disarm, sunder, or trip rolls. In addition, he may trip a creature up to one size category larger than he would be able to trip normally.

Greater Combat Style (Ex)

At 9th level, a fighter’s chosen combat style improves again. The bonuses from greater combat style supersede those given by combat style and improved combat style.

Archery
If the fighter has chosen the archery combat style, he gains a +4 bonus on to-hit and damage rolls when within 90 feet of a target. The Point Blank Shot feat has its maximum distance of effect increased to 90 feet. His ranged weapons have their base range increments multiplied by 2.5, and the fighter may apply his Dexterity bonus to damage rolls when using ranged weapons.

One-Handed Fighting
If the fighter has chosen the one-handed fighting combat style, any light shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 3, any heavy shield he wields has its armor class improved by 4, and any tower shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 5, but only when he wields a shield in one hand and a melee weapon in the other. (If he wishes, he may use a second shield as a melee weapon for this purpose, and making a shield bash does not disqualify him from this bonus.) He does not take a -1 to attack rolls for using a tower shield, and he may perform a shield bash with a tower shield. When performing a shield bash, the fighter gains an additional +1 bonus on attack rolls and a +2 bonus on damage rolls.

Two-Handed Fighting
If the fighter has chosen the two-handed fighting combat style, he gains a +3 bonus on attack rolls and a +6 bonus on damage rolls when wielding a melee weapon with two hands. In addition, he may apply twice his Strength modifier on damage rolls when wielding a melee weapon with two hands.

Dual-Wielding
If the fighter has chosen the dual-wielding combat style, his to-hit penalties from wielding two weapons are reduced by 3 (to a minimum of 0); this applies to the additional attacks granted by feats like Improve Two-Weapon. Whenever he hits with two or more attacks when wielding two weapons, he automatically rends the target for 2d6+xStrength modifier points of damage.

Greater Combat Stance (Ex)

At 11th level, the fighter’s combat stances improve. The bonuses and penalties given by improved combat stance supersede those given by combat stance and improved combat stance.

Aggressive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +4 bonus on attack rolls and a +8 bonus on damage rolls. In addition, his bonus on attack rolls from charging increases to +4, and he gains a +2 bonus on overrun and bull rush attempts. He may also overrun and bull rush opponents up to one size category larger than he normally would be able to overrun or bull rush normally.

Defensive
In this stance, the fighter gains DR 9/-. (This damage reduction stacks with that from other sources, such as from wearing adamantine armor.)

Evasive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +6 dodge bonus to Armor Class.

Tactical
In this stance, the fighter gains a +6 bonus on any disarm, sunder, or trip rolls. In addition, he may trip a creature up to two size categories larger than he would be able to trip normally.

Combat Style Mastery (Ex)

At 13th level, a fighter’s chosen combat style improves for a third time. The bonuses from greater combat style supersede those given by combat style, improved combat style, and greater combat style.

Archery
If the fighter has chosen the archery combat style, he gains a +5 bonus on to-hit and damage rolls when within 120 feet of a target. The Point Blank Shot feat has its maximum distance of effect increased to 120 feet. His ranged weapons have their base range increments multiplied by 3, and the fighter may apply his Dexterity bonus to damage rolls when using ranged weapons. In addition, the fighter may make an extra attack when taking a full-round or attack action, but all his attacks in that round take a -2 penalty. (This attack and penalty is in addition to the extra attack granted by the Rapid Shot feat.)

One-Handed Fighting
If the fighter has chosen the one-handed fighting combat style, any light shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 4, any heavy shield he wields has its armor class improved by 6, and any tower shield he wields has its Armor Class improved by 8, but only when he wields a shield in one hand and a melee weapon in the other. (If he wishes, he may use a second shield as a melee weapon for this purpose, and making a shield bash does not disqualify him from this bonus.) He does not take a -1 to attack rolls for using a tower shield, and he may perform a shield bash with a tower shield. When performing a shield bash, the fighter gains an additional +2 bonus on attack rolls and a +4 bonus on damage rolls, and he may apply his full Strength modifier on attack and damage rolls.

Two-Handed Fighting
If the fighter has chosen the two-handed fighting combat style, he gains a +4 bonus on attack rolls and a +8 bonus on damage rolls when wielding a melee weapon with two hands. He may apply twice his Strength modifier on damage rolls when wielding a melee weapon with two hands. In addition, every -1 penalty to hit the fighter takes when using the Power Attack feat while wielding a melee weapon with two hands gives him a +3 bonus on damage rolls.

Dual-Wielding
If the fighter has chosen the dual-wielding combat style, his to-hit penalties to hit are reduced by 4 (to a minimum of 0). Whenever he hits with two or more attacks when wielding two weapons, he automatically rends the creature for 3d6+Strength modifier points of damage.

Combat Stance Mastery (Ex)

At 15th level, the fighter’s combat stances improve for a third time. The bonuses and penalties given by improved combat stance supersede those given by combat stance, improved combat stance, and greater combat stance.

Aggressive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +5 bonus on attack rolls and a +10 bonus on damage rolls. In addition, his bonus on attack rolls from charging increases to +4, and he gains a +4 bonus on overrun and bull rush attempts. He may also overrun and bull rush opponents up to two size categories larger than he normally would be able to overrun or bull rush normally.

Defensive
In this stance, the fighter gains DR 12/-. (This damage reduction stacks with that from other sources, such as from wearing adamantine armor.)

Evasive
In this stance, the fighter gains a +8 dodge bonus to Armor Class.

Tactical
In this stance, the fighter gains a +10 bonus on any disarm, sunder, or trip rolls. In addition, he may trip a creature up to two size categories larger than he would be able to trip normally.

Secondary Combat Style (Ex)

At 17th level, a fighter chooses a secondary combat style. This combat style does not gain the bonuses of improved combat style, greater combat style, or combat style mastery.

Improved Secondary Combat Style (Ex)

At 19th level, a fighter’s secondary combat style improves as though affected by improved combat style.


Nurthin'?


B.T. wrote:
Basically, I was working on a project to "rebalance" the Core classes in D&D awhile back, and then I realized it was pointless, so I stopped. However, I had the work saved, and the second class that I worked on was the fighter. Allow me to show you what I did <snip>

Interesting. Do you see this working with the standard fighter bonus feat progression (that is, a bonus feat at 1st and all even levels)? I would suggest bonuses from feats like Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization (and any such "improved" and "greater" feats) should not stack with the attack and damage bonuses you describe because that's probably just too unbalancing.

I also feel like those feats are not as much "choices" for fighters as "requirements". If you are going to play a dedicated fighter (as opposed to multiclassing), you're probably going to take Weapon Focus at first level and Weapon Specialization at 4th. You almost have to: it's your job to hit as often as possible and for as much damage as you can scrape together. So rather than burn feats for this, make it a class ability.

I think the fighter's Weapon Training class ability (as described in the Alpha Release 1.1) should start as early as 2nd or 3rd level (early enough that a dedicated fighter can enjoy its benifits sooner, and costly enough that multiclassing with levels in fighter doesn't net too big a bonus for a one-level investment). These bonuses should not stack with Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization (etc). In this case, they'll effectively replace them for the fighter. You can still make them available to other classes (perhaps requiring a +5 BAB for WS instead of a minimum fighter level), but the dedicated fighter will be free to use his feats to define his style or put an unexpected trick up his sleeve.

Further, the bonuses to attack and damage gained through Weapon Training at higher levels could be a little more customizable. For instance, the example given in the text says "when a fighter reaches 9th level, he receives a +1 bonus to attack and damage rolls with one weapon group and a +2 bonus on attack and damage rolls with the weapon group selected at 5th level." Why couldn't the newly selected weapon group get the +2 bonus instead, leaving the first group at +1? The player should have the choice. Of course, once the choice is made, it should stick.

With this in mind, it's probably not necessary to have the fighter earn a new feat at every level. I would suggest dropping either the general feat progression (for all PCs) or the fighter bonus feat progression back to one every 3rd level. Otherwise, it's just too much stuff for the fighter.

Well, that my 2 coppers.

~ Andrew


There are some good ideas !!!

But I think the stances should be something else that just bonus to AC/attacks/etc ... Overspecialization tends to be boring at long time.

They could give you more options, like the Tactical stance giving you Spring Attack at some level.

Community / Forums / Archive / Pathfinder / Playtests & Prerelease Discussions / Pathfinder Roleplaying Game / Alpha Playtest Feedback / Alpha Release 1 / Races & Classes / Some ideas for a fighter fix. All Messageboards
Recent threads in Races & Classes
Non-SRD Classes