I've been stating out a druid/wizard PC and was wondering if one can have both a Animal Comp and a Familar?
I couldn't find anything mentioning yes/no to it or any examples listed in my books.
Personally, I don't see why it wouldn't work; but if that's the case, where does it say so/why not?
-Kurocyn
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Yes, a character that is both a Wizard and Druid can have a Familiar and an Animal companion. However, that character cannot have a Familiar that is also an Animal Companion, nor vice-versa(Familiars start out as unmodified creatures that become Magical Beasts, and Animal Companions cannot be Magical Creatures).
I'm not entirely sure. I have vague recollections of there being a restriction, but again, I'm not sure.
[slight_threadjack] However, if you really want to get the most bang for your companion, pick up Races of the Wild and take a look at the Arcane Heirophant prestige class. It let's you use your animal companion as your familiar, granting it the abilities of both. Not a bad little class. [/slight_threadjack]
There is a Prestige Class called Arcane Heirophant from the Complete Arcane that combines both the features of an Animal Companion and a Familiar together. It's mid-difficulty to qualify for pre-reqs, and requires some build-up "suck time" at the lower levels, but it's reasonably well-written and offers a cool concept at the cost of some power.
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IIRC, in the Races of the Wild there is a feat/prestige class that allows you to use the same creature for both animal companion and familiar.
As to why you can't do it normally, my understanding (without books to back it up) is that your familiar becomes a "magical beast" and animal companions are normally "beasts". That said, if you chose to rule they can be used for both purposes, watch how they stack together as you could end up with a "second PC."
Wow... The "I can't see any posts" causes some echoes...
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Pretty sure it's a Prestige Class ability that allows a Familiar Companion, but, with the advent of Feats that allow you to continue certain other class progressions (such as a Scouts Skirmish damage) with another classes advancement (such as Ranger levels, for Swift Hunters), it would be a logical variation for there to be a Feat for this as well.
I'll have to check Races of the Wild... Didn't even think to look there.
Though I do like the idea, I'm not really asking if they can be one in the same. I'm wondering if a PC could have both. My PC for example has/will have a dire bat animal comp and a bat familiar.
-Kurocyn
Nothing stops you from having both an animal companion and a familiar, but if I had this opportunity, I would not. In my opinion, one should be devoted to their animal companion (or familiar)and not get two friends.
For this reason, I would say that you idea is possible, but cruel to the first animal friend. It's like buying a kitten even though you already have a dog.
The wizard/druid in my current game has both (an otter familar and a wolf companion). It does a little extra note keeping so to speak but its not bad. He's actually going for the Arcane Heirophant PrC in The Races of the Wild and will most likely make the wolf his familar/companion. At first glance it looks like it might be a fairly powerful class.
As far as neglect of one animal over another I look at it as someone that has two best friends or a parent with two kids. They are both different but very important in their own way.
Take the "Loner" flaw and replace your familiar w/ a feat...
The PrC in Races of the Wild is Arcane Hierophant. The class ability allows you roll your familiar and animal companion into a single creature. Essentially, an animal companion (with all associated benefits) that also gains the same abilities as a familiar. I'm actually running a wizard/druid headed for Arcane Hierophant currently in a campaign. Good stuff.
Hmm... Just looked up the Arcance Hierophant.
Now I'm at a crossroads. I like the idea of having both an animal comp and familiar, but combining them into a companion familiar sounds pretty good too.
My original intent was to advance this PC into Mystic Theurge so both his Druid and Wizard levels would advance, allowing for a greater number of summon spells. But this class seems much better at the mix... On top of everything else, he'll even have a decent wild shape ability. Heck, the general flavor of the class even matches with the PC.
And thanks for clarifiying that he can have both, btw. ^ ^
-Kurocyn
An interesting note about Arcane Heirophant is that you don't actually NEED to have a familiar, or even the ability to acquire one, by the rules of the class (spirit of the rules may imply otherwise, but thats DM territory).
A Bard/Druid is a totally valid combo for Arcane Heirophant, by that regard. Or a Warlock, Wu Jen, or Hexblade /Druid. Interesting ideas!
Although, another note is that Rangers, despite what the class commentary says, CAN NOT become Arcane Heirophants. Look at the prereqs: Trackles Step. The comment about needing Druid OR Ranger levels to get the class feature is a bit off. Animal companion, yes, but Trackless step is Druid only.
The problem with having both a familiar and an animal companion is that they do not advance in abilities unless the character takes levels in the respective class or a PrC that specifically states that they do. The spells per day ability of every PrC always states that the character "does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained." (emphasis mine) Bards do not gain increases to Bardic Knowledge or additional Bardic Music, Clerics do not improve Turn Undead ability or Domain powers based on cleric level, etc. This applies to animal companions and familiars.
It's not worth having both. A druid 3/wizard 3/mystic theurge 10 would have an animal companion as a 3rd level druid and a familiar as a 3rd level wizard, not a druid 13 and wizard 13. The arcane heirophant PrC at least lets you combine the two AND improve the abilities while gaining spellcasting in two classes.
my whole problem with animal companions and familiars is they are usually just pieces of paper and have very little interaction in the game and players get all pissy if you smack one with the ugly stick; Sheesh, these things are supposed to be an advantage and some villians are always going to be jazzed to kidnap one and hold it ransom or kill it and run away just to grief a player; stuff like that; that is WHY they are called bad guys. Maybe it is just my players; I sometimes want a player for these campanions and familiars to give them a little juice; quite often i npc them and give them personalities, but it gets a little exhausting expecially doing npc npc interaction whereas I am really just talking to myself in front of the players; hehe that is always a bit strange.
Yes and no, Cato. This is for the same PC, but now that I know about the Arcane Hierophant, it's not just a question about him having a good summoner build. Now I'm deciding if I should wait for the Arcane Hierophant and advance his Druid levels so that he can gain Wild Shape, or if I should take the faster road with the Mystic Theurge.
Speaking of which, the Wild Shape example in the book says that a lv3 druid / lv3 wizard / 4th lv Arcane Hierophant can use Wild Shape as a lv 7 Druid... But a lv 3 druid would have never gained Wild Shape in the first place. He'd have to be lv 5 minimum... Am I missing something here? O.o?
Though I do like the idea of having both, I was never too concerned about thier advancement Dragonchess Player. Now that I've seen this class however, it's become more of a factor. The Channel ability works nicely with a flying companion familiar as well. ^ ^
I agree that many players couldn't care less about their familiars (or even companions sometimes); I've seen done it myself. But from the beginning, I've been gearing this PC more towards role-play and character interaction than combat. Incorporating his animal comp and familiar with this will come naturally.
Thank you all for your feedback btw.
-Kurocyn
The arcane hierophant increases one's level for the purposes of wild shape, but only if you have levels in a class that grants that ability (i.e. it increases your druid in regards to wild shape)
Grr... Paizo monster got my post again...
So just being a druid will work because they get Wild Shape eventually? Score. ^ ^
Makes this decision alot easier.
-Kurocyn