Suppose I run across an adventure I really like, but it is geared for 1st-lvl PCs and the party os 5th. Could I just give all the "goblins" in the adventure 5 levels of PC Classes as a starting point? Anyone tried this and had it blow up in their face?
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Well, I have had to do this with the Shackeled City Adventure Path. I started the AP when the PCs were already level 5. So obviously the first few adventures are going to be rather easy.
So, I changed a few things. Not wanting to change every single critter in the adventure, I simply gave the skulks and other low level critters extra hit points. I increased the number that are encountered.
But overall I only have changed the Named NPCs. These guys I completely redid from the ground up so they have a meaningful encounter. I only had to change about four NPCs and it took a couple of hours.
Now my situation is a little different in that I am doing the AP. So, I don't want them to level too much either or the rest of the adventures will be under powered for the PCs. So for the first few adventures I want them to progress slowly then as they catch up they will speed up. So the cannon fodder get very little done but the Bosses get total redos.
Oh and I can't wait for them to encounter the Goblins in the Forge. Low level Gobbers gonna make a nasty time for the PCs. Things like hot embers tossed in the faces (Reflex Save DC 20 save avoid it, fail by less than 10 blinded 1d6 rounds, fail by more than 10 you are blinded permanently). Funny, no one has Blind-Fight...
Actually, I've done that in several encounters and it's always worked out fine.
I generated generic fighters, sorcerers, clerics, and rogues of various levels. When I need to boost a monster (which happens with some frequency, since I rarely have time to prepare an adventure properly), I simply add the appropriate character's abilities, hit points, spells, etc., onto the monster in question. It always works out fine.
Of course, this isn't the best way to do it, but it works well when you don't have time to develop a creature more carefully.
While this method has never blown up in my face, there have been several times that encounters went in unexpected directions. For example, there were the "weak, low-hit-point, pushover" goblins (as one player put it. Each had several levels of rogue or fighter. It was a MUCH tougher fight than any of them expected.
Suppose I run across an adventure I really like, but it is geared for 1st-lvl PCs and the party os 5th. Could I just give all the "goblins" in the adventure 5 levels of PC Classes as a starting point? Anyone tried this and had it blow up in their face?
Watch out for certain assumptions built in to the scenario, e.g. that nobody has access to fly spells, which is fine for 1st level but not such a good assumption for an arbitrary group of 5th level PCs.
Oh, I haven't started really looking yet. However, I'm really considering smacking them around w/ Spider-eater's Revenge. The kids are itching to play REAL BAD, so I was thinking I might whup something out on them this weekend. PC mix is going to be something like 3PCs of 5th level, or really close to it. Dunno about class mix exactly, yet. We're going thru old char's and they are pulling out ones to play.
added: Altho Mad God's Key has a certain fascination for me, as well...
It generally works to just up the arsenal a bit, but you should consider any scenarios that are dependant upon the PCs NOT FEASIBLY having an ability, such as flight, dimension door, zone of truth, etc.
Ok, we're going with Mad God's Key and I'm upgunning it to at least 3rd level. Now, Mr. Bulmahn was kind enough to offer guidelines for upping it to challenge 3rd level parties. Does anyone have any ideas what could be done with it to challenge 5th-level parties while keeping the tone and length pretty much the same as it is now?
Thanks!
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 4, RPG Superstar 2011 Top 16
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LOL I've used various parts of Mad God's Key for 12th level parties! Ok it was mainly the maps but they're oh so good to use!!!
For example in the Blood Cairn most of my PC's could fly, slow fall, spider climb etc. My plan was if anyone just hopped down the waterfall chamber it would trigger a modified Guards & Wards that filled the Chasm with webs and the stairs with the confusing fog. I also placed three Symbols of Pain, Weakness, and Death at each landing triggered when crossed! They ended up wasting all their Dispel Magic's on the Symbols and had no debuffs for the Cleric of Cyric & his bodyguards trying to free a Hullathoin from the cairn.
For a 5th level group you might want to add in a few flying threats because they could very well have fly, levitate, and spider climb. Changing the scale of the map never hurts either so you can add in bigger skeletons. Upping the traps a bit wouldn't hurt either. A Glyph of warding at each landing can give rogues a chance to feel useful (beyond the alarm spell already there).
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Contributor
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I also incorporated Mad God's key into my campaign, again, mostly for the awesome map. The rivers of blood realy freaked out my players. I think they were 2nd level at the time, but a tough second level. They had a tough time with the swarm, but some of the other encounters were on the easy side, even when I boosted them a bit (I replaced the zombies with ghouls, but they were just a speed bump). I redid the entire final encounter, adding a few more clerics. In my version the cultists were about to perform a sacrifice, which made them feel more time pressure, although it was not my intention to have the cultists kill the sacrifice during combat.
I have a skeletal equiceph miniature, so I used it instead of the skeletal owlbear, and just used the stat card as is; That gave them a rough time. I also threw in a few bolstered skeletons that would pop up out of the blood stream, which mostly just added a distraction in the rear ranks. Fun times!
You are running this for your kids? How old are they? I'm running my 7 year old daughter and her friend through a 1st level adventure, and I just gave them 3rd level characters so that they can win without too much difficulty. Some of the fights I increase the numbers (mostly goblins and rats), but it doesn't really threaten them in a serious way, just makes them think they are in trouble. These particular kids aren't really ready for a greater threat than that.
Craig Shackleton
The Rambling Scribe
Well, the group opted to go with 3rd level characters, so I don't have to worry about flying. I'm taking the sidebar's advice as closely as I can - replace zombies w/ ghouls, Profane bonus to skeletons, etc. One thing I ran into - the final encounter with the owlbear ... is there ROOM for that thing in the area it is supposed to be?? That room seems mighty small and congested for a Large creature! I'm giving serious consideration to either changing the map-scale to 1 square = 10' (at least for that room) or swapping to a Medium undead of the proper CR. (altho figuring *that* out makes my head hurt, as I didn't see where using an ogre skeleton was tougher than the owlbear)
As for treasure, I doubt I'll change very much of it, as I will be adding two levels worth of gear onto the NPCs. Given my group's proclivities, they will end up with everything the NPCs start with, minus a few potions. ;) IF they ended up with other treasure, they'd sell it to finance BBB gear for themselves, after all. This, of course, means I have a NUMBER of NPCs to upgun before tomorrow. I *am* going to leave the opening scene alone, the docks encounters other than Irontusk won't change, and the junior Green Dagger members will stay Exp1's. Everyone else gets the 2-level boost. Plus, I'll borrow the idea of having skeletons ready to stagger out of the river of blood if they are having things a little too - easy/undistracted/etc.
On Irontusk - should I make him a straight Bbn4 or give him 2 levels as Rogue for a Bbn2/Rog2? I mean, his main use is as a "coursing rabbit" for the PCs to chase down and intimidate.
(does it bother anyone else to see an NPC with 200+ gp in a belt pouch? That's over FOUR POUNDS of coinage! Strap a bag of flour to *your* waist and see how you do in a fight!)
My daughter is 6, and has been playing since she was 4 - she has no problem taking on level-appropriate encounters at this point, largely due to her experience as a gamer and the fact she plays with other folks ranging from 13 (my son) on up thru 23 and on to 38. She takes advice and suggestions better than my son does *and* tends to think her actions through a bit better. (opening encounter of Red Hand of Doom she refused to use a bead from her Necklace of Fireballs, pointing out it would set the forest on fire...)
Mad God's Key is just an awesome adventure...