What is the smallest effective group size you have played with?
My Group went from 6 players + DM to 4 + DM in a year, now we only have 3 players in town + DM, and may start playing with just that. I am worried that the group will be to small to get a lot of ideas going and maintain momentum.
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I had great games with a 2 players + DM group, but both players were gaming veterans and enjoyed the fact, that their characters got more spotlight than in a game with five or more players.
A small group can be a great opportunity to outplay the characters and have a more story-focussed game.
But with less experienced gamers i imagine that it could be a drawback too...
The problem can be the adventures. If you use adventures from Dungeon or other ressources you'll have some work with scaling them to suit your small group.
I currently run games with DM + 2 or 3 players. Players often play multiple PCs (something that normaly I don't like, but haven't had any trouble with, with this group) so that we have 4 -6 PCs per session. When I run play tests I usually draft additional players. Recruiting was mainly through someone I knew and then someone they knew, and then someone they knew and then Keven Bacon.
I have DMed for groups of up to 12 players. That can be fun as well, but those were 1st and 2ed days. Since 3.0, by biggest group has been about 6.
ASEO out
I guess it depends on the personality of the players. I DM for a bunch of high school kids and if there are too many (we played seven + DM once) they can get a bit distracted in combat when they have to wait a long time for their turn. I am now making a seperate campaign with new kids who want to play (it is gonna run parallel to the current campaign temporaly, logistically and storywise).
If you run a game with experienced D&D players who have a lazer focus about the game you can push the upper limits. They will know how to "assist" the DM in game pacing, flow and organization.
I have heard about 1 player + DM having the greatest campaign ever.
My main group is 3 people + me. AoTW is 4 + me, and at my birthday super adventure I'm maxin it out at 7 + me.
DM + anywhere from 2-5. One time it was just DM + 1, but luckily that only happened once.
WaterdhavianFlapjack
I have DMed groups from 2 all the way up to 8 players. I have done complete campaigns at both ends of the spectrum and in between.
The quality of the game isn't the number of players but their experience in playing. We recently had one of our players move away, and we barely noticed the difference because he hardly did anything. If there wasn't anything to kill, he would pretty much put his head down. Now we have 3, but we're all good so if flows. Too many isn't good either, as I DM'd a group of my middle school students and they (all 7) went in completely different directions, it was a nightmare for me and it turned boring for them.
Thanks for all the advice everyone. I think we are definately going to move forward with a couple ideas you have given me. In my group I have 3 different types of players left, a rules guy, an eccentric, and a hack & slasher...I think I can make it work with the right amount of NPC play to assist them.
What is the smallest effective group size you have played with?
Two players and me as the DM; but, as part of ongoing campaigns, I've sometimes played a session with one player and DM to fill in gaps in the story or to add a spark to the character's progression (Sometimes, if someone misses a session, I'll decide that it's because their character was called off somewhere, and run that session with them prior to getting back to the main group).
I've really ranged in my DMing days, though. I recall in highschool AD&D and AD&D 2e, having first 2 players, then eight (that was too much), then hitting university and getting to something insane like 10 players (which, in the homebrew story I was working on, turned out fine, as I split them 5 and 5 and they went separate ways on seperate evenings, and then eventually met up and split up in different groups of 5 and 5 over the course of the campaign.. it was fun).
Since 3.0 and 3.5, I think the smallest has been three players (barring evenings where it was a one-on-one session like those above), and the largest was seven players and a DM. My Shackled City group is mutating again (we started with seven, lost the typical "not really interested partner of the roleplayer" player, then lost one player to his band, stayed stable at five characters for a good while, now two got married and are moving to Halifax, and we're grooming another couple we know to replace them in the group... it's fun).
I have heard about 1 player + DM having the greatest campaign ever.
I've not only heard about this, but actualy done it as well. In fact, it's become my weapon of choice as a DM (but that's probably just due to my inability to herd cats)
Most players: 5 (didn't do so well)
Least players: 1
One-on-one made for an intense game session. Two was just as good. I find that 3-4 is my preferred size. My current group is 3 players + 1 DM - just perfect. The players are often a cohesive team and play off each others abilities and tactics.
My suggestion to you (or anybody else) is really pay attention to your players and give them all a chance to shine. One of my players is an ambassador's son, so when it's time for Diplomacy, he steps up and wows the opposition. Another player, the unofficial "leader" is charismatic enough to either intimidate or sweet-talk information out of someone, he's there. And the last player - Artillery and magic know-how. Pay attention to what your players want (the DMG 2 has a really good section on this!) and you'll probably find that "size matters not" when playing with a small group.
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The least amount of players I've ever DMed for was one player. The game goes really quick, allows the player to do what they want, and expects a lot out of the player. I believe the character was a Drow rogue.
The largest group I've ever been in was around 9 people. I've done this twice, and I'll say this: Never again.
While one of the games was great (Ravenloft) it ended up being a spectator game for hours on end.
The other was a home brew game created by a not so good first time DM. It was a constant source of stress, and most of us dropped it out of annoyance.
Personally, my favorite group size is 4 or 5.
I've run as few as 3 + DM, but that was years ago;
I started my latest group with 8 players, it grew up to 14 at one point, and then it recently dropped down to 7 people, due to a new kid for one couple and the college term starting for others.
This group is chronicled *here…* and *here…*
Now that the group is smaller (I had forgotten how much more fun it can be), I'm officially capping the group size at 10 people, since I'll have 9 after the couple returns from maternity leave.
M
What is the smallest effective group size you have played with?
I've DM'd (successfully) just 1 player, with myself playing an NPC (really a PC). Then we'd switch roles. This was back in 1E days.
I can definitely say that I don't enjoy padding out a group with players playing multiple PCs. Makes for slow-going, I think. I'm in a Realms-based game where we're playing 2 characters each. It has its moments but I'd rather just focus on one character.
- Chris Shadowens
Hello, I'm 33 and have been playing/DMing since I was about 12. I DM a group of 5 players, who are all pretty much experienced. We play only once every two weeks, so every one tries to be present when we play. Usually the adventures I have my players go through are for the full group, but I find it fun to have them play solos or duos from time to time. Then when they get back together, it's fun to watch them tell each other what happened on their seperate adventures. On another note; I have another question to all you DMs out there... Is it just me, or am I the only one to have a problem with the real-time hours it takes to resolve those pesky high-level fights? Man, I feel like I'm playing Battletech sometimes. I feel like the story doesn't move forward as fast as the old (or low-level) games.
I haven't purchased th DMG 2 yet, I guess I might give it spin if would help this situation out.
I've run as few as 3 + DM, but that was years ago;
I started my latest group with 8 players, it grew up to 14 at one point, and then it recently dropped down to 7 people, due to a new kid for one couple and the college term starting for others.
This group is chronicled *here…* and *here…*
Now that the group is smaller (I had forgotten how much more fun it can be), I'm officially capping the group size at 10 people, since I'll have 9 after the couple returns from maternity leave.
M
I'd cap it at 9 and then wait until attrition removed another player and cap it at 8. Even 10 is a monsterously large group.
BTW is your group located in a big city?
I found that the minute I started DMing was I was being besieged by willing players and yet from some of the posts it often seems that most DMs have trouble finding a group. My current hypothosis is its easy to find lots of players in a city and hard if your in a small town.
I once played in a long term campaign in FR where it was just me and the DM - and it worked brilliantly. The largest was a session with 14 and two DMs, as a special 'crossover' event between two gaming groups (tough to run, make sure the parties are the same levels, but very fun).
Am currently running a group of 3 plus DM, and having probably the most fun ever, as they are a cohesive group of roleplayers whose days of power playing are far behind them and the story thread of backgrounds and current campaign are developing into something none of us saw coming.
Reggie
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My main group has six people, of whom one does the majority of the DMing.
Personally, I like 4-6 players and 5-8 characters, in particular I find that published adventures tend to need relatively more PCs -- IMO the idea that four characters is the right size for a party in official adventures is nonsense unless they're all celestial half-dragon dire ninjas or the players go through the adventure like a SWAT team.
While I'm running games for 4-5 players with 1 PC each now, I have run games for as few as 1 player with 4 PC's.
When one player plays multiple PC's, I have not encountered major problems. Sometimes I actually believe that one player playing multiple PC's enhances role-playing, because the player seems to realize that he/she has a responsibility to play each PC different.
Having said that...I very much enjoy it when two PC's get into an argument about something...and they're both played by the same player.
My wife is currently playing two PC's in the SCAP--a hotblooded female Centaur wizard and a crusading, lecturing cleric of St. Cuthbert, who very much gets on the Centaurs nerves. We've all had a lot of fun with that.
Last year I played "Dragon Mountain" with just myself, one other player and the DM. It was great, we got through large sections of the maps in record time, and had a blast with the roleplaying as well. In my mind I have to agree that the smallest effective group size is truly up to the players. If they WANT to play, then they WILL make it work.
On the other side of the spectrum, my current group has ballooned to 7 players with one more possibly on the way. This group is just as much fun for me! The greater number of players brings huge variables to the table and I never know what the party will do next. Sure, it's a little slower than last years campain, but when the ranger gets dragged screaming up the stairs in the maw of the purple Wyste ('Speaker in Dreams' from WotC) having six other player start yelling at the same time as to what they want to do to save him makes my DM heart smile.