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Faunra's eyes look through the crowd of people. "Well I would like to get my superiors' input on this matter first. What does the head of the guard think? What does the mayor think? I'm in no rush to leave. I must make sure my position is filled by someone trustworthy first."

Faunra takes a small sip from the fountain before filling her waterskin with it. She seemed unconcerned about the bats, being nature's creatures after all, unlike those ghastly skeletons. In the room with the statues, things began to take a nasty turn. It sends her adrenaline pumping again.

"Gods I hope what they say about the famous elven agility is true!" Faunra says as she runs past the statues, nearly tripping on her feet as she does so. "Brayken, be careful with that, it's not a toy!" she says as if almost scolding him.

Acrobatics: 1d20 + 2 ⇒ (3) + 2 = 5

The problem seems to be that not only do people play CN as evil lite.

But they also believe that LE IS evil lite just by virtue of following the rules. It's easier to 'predict' so it's better. If an LE guy is less prone to backstabbing the good and chaotic party members than a CN guy something is seriously wrong. Backstabbing is supposed to be LEs bread and butter. Within limits sure, but just openly submitting to a paladin or whatever with no intention to put yourself back on top because serves the 'greater purpose' of their Lawful Evil organization is and excuse my language--a b$+*$ass move. LEs are there to dominate or at least make sure whoever they serve does.

And for that CN gets a lot of undeserved hate. So in the end, with this sentiment, we don't end up with more alignments to choose from, but less.

And this is coming from a guy who likes those alignments to bits.

Soon there will be people proudly claiming on this board that they only allow LG because Chaos is bad and Neutral is too close to evil.

Shame I can't find anything to help with the imagery. I want some art of more bestial tieflings. Spawn that reflects the relative diversity of fiends. Not just your standard scantily clad girl with ram/goat horns (and sometimes red skin).

Oh and I think demon and devil spawn tieflings would work just fine. And I believe Blood of Fiends is decent enough.

Nobody mentioned the Shoanti. I feel they warrant a mention because they're like the native americans in a way, so they'd be good if you wanted to make an aztec or mayan something or other. If you want something more spanish, I'd go Taldan because they've often been compared to Spain.

It'd be helpful to figure out what OP wants exactly for a character. Otherwise you invoke all these people that believe you're trying to demand an exact replica of Mexico in Golarion and get all indignant about you mucking up their fantasy with the real world and trying to bring your cultural 'baggage' into the setting.

Although I do see that Paizo has taken some elements from real-world history and used them as inspiration for parts of Golarion... I do not see any of the nations/peoples of Golarion as a direct analog for any real-world nation or ethnic group-- and I'd prefer to keep it that way.

While I like complex themes and social issues in my fantasy games, I still prefer to keep them fantasy, not something overly tangled up in reality. Draw on history-- yes. Mistake fictional places as stand-ins for real nations, no.

I'm actually quite tired of hearing this statement because unless we're doing something where every single thing is completely alien, there are real world analogues. I consider it a good thing. The only time people like to bring out this statement is when somebody else is complaining about a culture not being represented. The rest of the time, I think everybody knows the score.

I must admit I feel a degree of Schadenfreude when a gm takes a stringent stance against nongoods only to end up with a bunch of people who play 'good in name only'.

I'd much prefer to play with someone who would actually be up front about it and write evil on their sheet.

In all fairness people do the exact same thing with Batman and 90s anti-heroes. Batman has had moments like that in various incarnations. But people are all too willing to knock something without reading it over 1 work, and sometimes not even that.

Am I the only one who is starting to think complaining about this cliche has become an even bigger cliche?

Just throwing this out there: I think it's undesirable for Pathfinder players and GMs to try to match the fictional countries of Golarion to Earth cultures and locations.

Unless it's Japan, Russia, revolutionary France, China, India, South Africa, Scandanavia, the Byzantine empire, or Arabia.

Short answer: There is no straightforward equivalent for Ireland. Many have asked, many have been given unsatisfactory answers.

In the end there are countries where the real world equivalent is glaringly obvious (they might have a few changes or quirks, but you'd be picking straws) and other ones where it's just Middle-Easter-ish, Chinese-esque or generic European. It depends on what you're looking for. Most people say Nirmathas, but it's not as strong a comparison as with many of the others. It's basically a wooded country full of rangers that's broken off from a bigger evil country and at war with some other country with a really sinister sounding name. There was something in a module with some vaguely Celtic trappings from what I heard.

Since it sounds like it's just the name, I'd say maybe someone from the places up north with the Ulfens or Varisians, Nirmathas, or anywhere with a decent sized elfen population.

See, I think it should be my right to insult misanthropes. I mean, they hate me anyway. Way I see it, there's no point in NOT treating them poorly. Though in the interest in forum rules, I suppose there is no reason I should not abide by that.

DM Under The Bridge wrote:

Icyshadow wrote:

Implying my personal view on the condition of our species is just a phase that will pass is pretty rude, you know. I find the people who think we're the best thing to ever come to existence rather obnoxious myself, but rather than mock them by claiming their view to be a phase (which is an ad hominem anyway), I instead present arguments to counter their views. I also find it hilarious when some people get upset about the fact that humans are animals too, and not this chosen glorious master race some random God handpicked as the rulers of this world and those beyond. Aside from the way our brain is structured and our capacity for destruction (both towards the environment as well as towards animals of all kinds), we're not really that different from the rest of the beings living on this planet.

Perhaps, but Odraude isn't the only one who has gone through this phase, and got over it. Adolescence gets old after a while.

I am really trying to understand what adolescence has to do with Icyshadow's personal philosophy. Care to elaborate?

Well there's a lot of kind of, whiny, angry, melodramatic teenage subcultures. You know, like goth kids. They dress in black, sneer at practically everyone. They're young, and they hate their peers, their town and their parents and if humanity just choked on its own greed and cruelty, that'd that'd be a-ok with them. They say this sort of gross over-generalization about the world being destroyed by the human virus because it's a quick and easy way to look like they have some deep insight about the world and humanity (or yoomanity if you're Martin Sheen). So they say things about overpopulation and the cruelty of wars in a dark, edgy cynical way because when you're young and cynical, that's kind of what you do.

I'm not saying that's what he's doing, but that's pretty much how I'd answer this question.

To be fair I have seen some adults talk this way, but I actually find it quite hard not to snicker and think 'Hey way to sound like me when I was 16 and listened to a lot of alt metal'

Oh and if any of the mods feel I'm nearing going just a little bit over the line, let me know.

As for the topic at hand, I feel that many non-humanocentric settings I see come off as gimicky and different for the sake of different. I actually hope one of these days, the so called 'standard fantasy setting' gets a good reconstruction, and maybe we can go back to the days when people approached the elves and the dwarves and their cities with a sense of awe instead of needing a half-celestial ratfolk shaman on every street corner just so we don't feel jaded about fantasy. Not that I have any problem with non-humanocentric settings. I even helped a bud with his. I just think it should be more about presentation than different for the sake of different. I've seen a lot of hack writers come up with ideas for weird settings and races which just went nowhere and had nothing compelling about them. I don't think a setting needs to be non-humanocentric to be fantastical. Look at Nex and Kaer Maga for example. They're strange places but they're still overwhelmingly humanocentric, and done right I think a setting like that would do a lot more to feel fantastical than upping the number of tengu or whatever. Feel free to call me on it if I'm oversimplifying, but I figure humanocentricity is a thing that's called out a lot because A) Making a non-humanocentric setting is another way to be 'different and thus remedy some of the jadedness the fans face regarding fantasy in general and B) Some people just really like non-human races and feel they don't get enough love.

Huh I find it rude to imply that "humanity" consists of modern, christian, westerners in the industrialized world, but that's just me.

That's not my point at all. I was just illustrating my train of thought. My point was their names are basically anagrams of each other and there are some similar aspects in the backstories.

Sure it's not one to one, but there's still a lot there.

ArIbeth IrAbeth

So a thread about Paladins and betrayal, in which it is suggested that the best route for such an occurence involves the death of a lover.

The paladin in question is female, prominent in the first act, and supposedly nigh incorruptible, humble, down to earth etc., with a backstory involving dead parents.

Did anyone here play Neverwinter Nights 1. Because if you switch the A with the I........

I know a half-African guy I play tabletop rpgs online with with (sometimes he runs too) who makes fun of me for playing Pathfinder with a bunch of fat white guys, since he plays indie rpgs with a group that's half or more than half women with a gay guy or something and he says the big fantasy games are full of fat white straight guys. Even though he knows of and has made fun of people I've played Pathfinder with who are 'nontraditional' as you say. Yeah he's kind of a dick I guess.

I think for me most of the time, it's probably about half or more straight white guys with a couple people who aren't, but that's not saying much since my groups don't tend to be that big.

I'm simply trying to get a feel for how many people out there in the European time zone are looking to play or potentially run a Pathfinder game and are at least partially familiar with Roll20.

You know, I was going to say you should chastise them, but it might be funny to spring some ridiculous trap on them when they're gloating(because karma) or about to betray everyone(because humorous anticlimax) and when they complain, write it off, saying it's a 'narrative game' and you did it to give it a cinematic feel. I honestly don't think anyone would complain.

Don't really get why these people do this. Because they think it makes them clever or because it's exciting? Not really. It's just something 14 year olds do which ruins nongood characters for everyone else.

This comic is relevant.

Raining Blood- Slayer

that's all

Or you know, you could look it up on wikipedia and use that definition.

Or take it apart.

It's GAMING focused on POWER.

magnumCPA wrote:

Founder's Dirty Bastard.

I love me some Founder's Brewing. I lucked out and the brewery is about a 10 minute drive from my bed. If anyone is nearby, I would recommend keeping an eye for the one-offs, especially Sleeper Cell.

....lucky. I wanted to visit Founder's or Great Lakes, but they're kind of far away.

Good Juju is a good one too, I visited Left Hand Brewery this summer.

Not to powergame. Powergaming entails putting mechanics over roleplay which means a lot of mechanics talk I don't have the patience for. Most people who I consider powergamers do little to no actual roleplaying, even if they say they do. They may cry 'badwrongfun' when someone complains about their playing "style", but I don't really see what's fun about it.

I thought they were cavemen. Like Neanderthals or something else that's very neolithic. They just seem like they're by far the most primitive human race in Golarion and that's sort of their hat. And if it's not that, it's just living in the worst possible landscape. It's like they either live where civilization was either ended or hasn't started yet. Either being cavemen for generations or some kind of post-apocalyptic tribe.

I think the Neanderthal idea kind of figures into the whole German thing, with the Neanderthals being named after a part of northern Germany after all.

I'm gonna make a math formula for this:

(time spent talking mechanics) + {time spent gushing about how badass their char build is)/(time spend actually roleplaying - time spent arguing with gm that their character isn't broken)= power gaming quotient

Give them some drinks and secretly crush up some ritalin and slip it in there.

I was in a game where they got rid of it and it was completely fine. The world didn't end. In a lot of games these labels are completely arbitrary. If you're wondering through a dungeon slaughtering hostile monsters, there isn't really a difference between good and neutral.

I'm starting to dislike alignment a lot. I didn't used to, but everyone's banning evil alignment pcs and some are moving onto banning chaotic neutral pcs and then there's radar paladins, who use their magic see-evil vision to decide whether or not it's okay to decapitate someone. It's not even entirely linked to whether or not I buy into there being absolute good and absolute evil, but I don't buy that there is no moral ambiguity in the pathfinder world. And even if you believe there is absolute good, disagreements on alignment are way too frequent for one to say everyone always agrees on what chaotic good is or whatever.

Anyway, I believe detect evil just makes things too easy unless you implement that houserule where it's mostly for outsiders and undead. Banning alignments gives me the impression that the DM thinks that I'm the same as their friend who played a neutral evil character and sabotaged the game by killing everyone and taking the treasure when they were 14 and then went 'um im neutral evil, it's called roleplaying scrub'. I mean what happened to individual accountability.

Sierra Nevada, since nobody here's mentioned that.

Also Left Hand Milk Stout, or Founder's Dirty Bastard.

And if none of those, maybe Corona or Guinness.

Don't do anything. You'll look like you're trying too hard, and I don't think there's a way that won't come off as extremely transparent and heavy handed.

Plus I'm also getting pretty sick of these 'gah, nobody will be tank/healer, what do I do?'. It's their prerogative, leave it to them.

Also, I think there is a chance that anyone who gets up in the big scary ogre's face while their friends pelt at it safely from a distance will probably start to feel like a sucker. Roy included possibly. Doesn't matter what fancy archetype or skill points they got.

Don't worry yourself bud. Just because some people on the internet like to complain about Israel doesn't mean the IDF won't get support from the people who matter. If you haven't noticed, not being behind Israel 110% is political suicide in the US.