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drbrain wrote:

Ferious Thune wrote:

manbearscientist wrote:

drbrain wrote:

So here's a question: can you Magic Missile into Striking Spell? If so, does that change the value at all?

It does appear that can, as the criteria is just: can target one creature or object. Magic Missile can be target a single creature.

Magic Missile gets no benefit from a crit, so all you are doing is making it dependent on an attack roll.

The main reason I ask is I was looking at a similar ability in Channel Smite, which basically staples 1 Action Heal/Harm onto a melee attack. Magic Missile is a similar 1 to 3 action spell, so I wondered if being able to staple a 1 action Magic Missile into a melee attack (or bow shot with Shooting Star) while still maintaining a spare action to move or Shield (which then kinda turns the ability into Sudden Charge for Slide Magus) could be factored into the thought experiment here, and if that changed anything

But there's no reason to put the magic missile in your weapon. Just cast a 1 action magic missile and let it do its damage. If you put it in your weapon,, you're adding the need to make an attack roll to a spell that doesn't have one.

Yeah on talking through it, MM in this case is just a cheeky way to trigger Slide or Steel Magus while preserving a spare action, with the possible extra damage as gravy

manbearscientist wrote:

drbrain wrote:

So here's a question: can you Magic Missile into Striking Spell? If so, does that change the value at all?

It does appear that can, as the criteria is just: can target one creature or object. Magic Missile can be target a single creature.

Magic Missile gets no benefit from a crit, so all you are doing is making it dependent on an attack roll.

The main reason I ask is I was looking at a similar ability in Channel Smite, which basically staples 1 Action Heal/Harm onto a melee attack. Magic Missile is a similar 1 to 3 action spell, so I wondered if being able to staple a 1 action Magic Missile into a melee attack (or bow shot with Shooting Star) while still maintaining a spare action to move or Shield (which then kinda turns the ability into Sudden Charge for Slide Magus) could be factored into the thought experiment here, and if that changed anything

So here's a question: can you Magic Missile into Striking Spell? If so, does that change the value at all?

Now, the real question is: Can this combination of traits and feats negate the light blindness penalty of the "Drow-Blooded" trait for half-elves?

This is a thread for all those that are bummed about the Iroran Paladin archetype from Inner Sea Combat being unable to build into Champion of Irori.

For those that don't know, Champion of Irori is a prestige class that blends Monk and Paladin. It requires Smite Evil from Paladin and Still Mind from Monk, among other things, as prerequisites. Unfortunately, the new Paladin archetype (Iroran Paladin, which adds some monk-like attributes to the Paladin class and links to the same god as the Prestige Class) that should fit into this theme completely shuts you out of that Prestige Class, as it replaces Smite Evil :(

Aside from reaching out for solidarity, I'd love to know the reasoning behind this. Ideally, someone official will see this and answer, but in absence of that, if anyone with better grasp of the rules than I have could tell me why this combination would be frowned upon, please enlighten me.

Hopefully, if enough Brothers and Sisters of Irori can stand and be heard, we could get some errata maybe? A kung fu Paladin can dream, can't he? ;)

Like I said, I don't intend to focus on summoning anyway. I'm the ranged/control guy in a party that's already got enough stab and smash.

However, the invisibility power combined with the ability to summon bats as a standard action instead of a full round (remember, summoning doesn't break invisibility) will, I suspect, lead to more than a few very surprised rooms of bad guys in my future :3

Oh, nvm. I typed that wrong. CHA should be 8 in the above post.

Dump the charisma harder. You were raised by bats.

lol I wasn't raised by bats necessarily, I just like them better than people :3

I guess since he's from the spooky night hunter barbarian tribe, I could get away with a little less CHA. I'm just the kind of guy that hates dumping stats that hard I suppose. I'll see what it'd get me and go from there. I'll probably dump it to 7 and buff either WIS or STR. That'll give me two stats to put my ability boosts into later. Since I'm focusing more on control spells, and since my domain gives me stuff like Sleep and Blindness, probably WIS for the boost to spell DCs later. If I go STR, I'll probably slap Adaptive on the composite bow when I can.

NEW LEVEL 1 BUILD!

Human Druid (Bat Shaman)

STR: 14
DEX: 17
CON: 12
INT: 10
WIS: 14
CHA: 9

Faction: Andoran

Feats: Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Blind Fight
Traits: Shoanti Tattoo, Hunter's Eye (Longbow)

Weapons:
Longbow
Club
Scimitar
Shoanti Bolas

Armor:
Leather Armor

Future Plans:
My first Prestige purchase will probably be a 2 STR masterwork composite longbow, and I might use my gold to pick up a better scimitar if I can swing it. First big magic item purchase is probably going to be an Efficient Quiver.

As for feats, you've convinced me to take Rapid Shot at level 3. I was originally going to buff my INT and take Focused Shot, but I guess I'll have to save that for an Arcane Archer someday :)

Level 7, I'll probably take Natural Spell, but idk what I'll want at level 5.

Any suggestions for my level 5 feat or future magic items?

Oh, also, I've been debating on whether I should buy a shield for when I have to get in melee. Anyone got any thoughts on that?

Grapple

Move: You can move both yourself and your target up to half your speed. At the end of your movement, you can place your target in any square adjacent to you. If you attempt to place your foe in a hazardous location, such as in a wall of fire or over a pit, the target receives a free attempt to break your grapple with a +4 bonus.

If that going to be your schick I implore you to take a level of
Barbarian for rage to boost your STR. Also to lower your DEX and Raise your STR because your CMB suck being 3/4 per level +1 for STR. Becasue that cool idea but you build dose not suport that tacit well.

Well it's not going to be my signature move or anything, and they don't get the grapple break attempt until the end of my movement, if I read that correctly. They are welcome to force me to let go when they're already 10-20 feet off the ground hahaha.

On another note, I'll be posting a revised level 1 build and plans for the future later today.

Altarlost:"And you will not summon bats more than once for kicks. There is only one bat and it's not one of the stand out summons. "

That's where you're wrong. Bat Shamans can apply certain templates to their summoned bats. At level 5 using SNA 3, I can summon one regular Dire Bat or multiple Young Dire Bats, Giant or Advanced templated Dire Bats starting at level 7 using SNA 4, and Giant Advanced Dire Bats starting at level 9 using SNA 5. And, if I read everything right, I should be able to use, for example, SNA 5 to summon multiple Giant or Advanced Dire Bats.

Admittedly the summons aren't my focus here, but I do get a few options when it comes to the size and strength of summoned bats. plus, they get temporary HP so that's cool.

I'm pretty adamant about archery as my default attack. produce flame is cool, don't get me wrong, and seeing it has convinced me to take Rapid Shot as my 3rd level feat so i can be a gatling gun with either if need be, but the whole point of the bow is that ultimately I can trick it out to be better than firebombing and it's one less "mandatory" spell.

One idea has also convinced me to get Natural Spell at level 7:
-Change into Dire Bat
-Cast Lockjaw on self
-grab Medium or smaller bad guy
-Fly up
-let go
-laugh as bad guy goes splat
-repeat steps 3 through 6 for each applicable enemy as desired
-laugh again

on the topic of a faction change, does the fame/PP i earned in my 1st session carry over to the new faction, or will it reset to zero?

I do like some of Tom's suggestions for a more control based build. A few things though:
-I can't Heirloom in Shoanti Bolas, they're exotic. I sort of want to keep them though for the control potential, since we don't have a bard who can cast grease everywhere.

-The longbow is something I'm attached to mostly for flavor purposes. The Shoanti clan he's with are archers/hunters, and having a solid ranged attack I don't need to burn spells for seemed snazzy. Better than toting a sling, anyway :P If it's really going to hurt me that awfully much, I guess I'm willing to drop it for spearchucking, but if the difference is marginal, then I'd like to keep the bow. Looking at the factions again, I could see him fitting in with the Andoran, since they're enemies of Cheliax and so are the Shoanti, so the bow proficiency trait works there.
I played my first game claiming Grand Lodge as my faction. Can I still change before level 2 without penalty?

I feel like I should apologize for my wonky stats for some reason lol. I'm a little new to Pathfinder Society, though I've played Pathfinder at home before, and I'm the kind of guy that doesn't want to be absolutely poop at something just in case it's my (insert skill check I'm bad at here) that becomes clutch for the party. I will be adjusting them in a more focused manner though :)

As for my heirloom, I can have one item with Masterwork Transformation cast on it, and it's a 2nd level spell on pretty much every spell list. I shouldn't have much trouble finding an NPC to mumbo some jumbo over it, or just wait till level 3 to zap it myself. I can then enchant it as I like, if I'm not mistaken. Unless I'm somehow barred from even casting that on it. I shouldn't really even need Natural Spell/Natural Speech too badly, since at level 5 my Totem Transform lets me grow wings and fly for flying caster purposes in a fight, and it's 1min/level per day. Any other uses of bat form would usually be as an "eye in the sky" between fights right?

Only reason I thought I might need a little Charisma was in case I had to Wild Empathy something. Then again, I guess dealing with animal NPCs is what Charm Animal is for, when you get down to it. My summoned bats will attack without me having to Charisma check against them won't they?

Just recently played the start of a PFS campaign at my FLGS. I built a sort of odd Bat Shaman Druid and I'd like some help planning for the future to make him as cool as possible.

Nahaak "Speaks With Shadows"

Lvl 1 Human(Shoanti) Druid (Bat Shaman)

STR: 13
DEX: 15
CON: 12
INT: 13
WIS: 15
CHA: 12

Druid Doman: Night

FEATS:
-Point Blank Shot
-Precise Shot
-Blind Fight (from Night Domain)

Traits:
Shoanti Tattoo
Heirloom Weapon (Proficiency-Longbow)

WEAPONS:
Longbow
Club
Scimitar
Shoanti Bolas

That's the basics I've got so far. I added "Heart of the Wilderness" to his Human racial traits as well. I intended for him to be a sort of shamanic hunter, his main mode of attack being the longbow (which I will have Masterwork Transformation cast upon ASAP), and using his druid spells for support and utility. I'd like to stay a primarily ranged character, as the rest of the party are primarily melee (Samurai, Rogue, and melee focused Cleric). I can still rebuild, since I'm level 1, so aside from wanting to stay ranged and a Bat Shaman I'm not super attached to anything else here. Any advice for the future of this character?

Sadly, Master Craftsman doesn't seem to count for Forge Ring. However, Craft Wondrous Item does cover a lot of what I want to make and most are cloth based and so covered under tailoring :3

Not having the required CL just means +5 DC. A monk can still craft them - it's just a bit more of a challenge. You still need the appropriate feat, though, and the appropriate skill (depending on what you're making). All other missing prerequisites just add five to the DC.

What I was specifically referring to was the fact that the item creation feats themselves required a caster level. Ptolmaeus found what I was looking for, the Master Craftsman feat, to bypass not being a wizard or cleric or such. Thank you very much for such a speedy reply :)

So I want my monk to make a few monk-specific magic items on his own (Ring of Ki Mastery, Headband of Ki Focus, etc.) but all the magic item feats require a caster level. However, a number of these items require a ki pool or to be a monk to create. So, does that mean that I'd have to be a wizard/monk to make it work? Or am I missing something that would give monks an out here? I feel like I read something that let monks make such items, but I could just be crazy. Anyone know the answer to this or have suggestions as to how I could go about this?

Ah, thank you. My gut was telling me it was just the dice, but when I put it in Hero Lab it wasn't stacking right.

Reference: Champion of Irori PFSRD page

Under the Champion's Ki Pool ability, it mentions that a Champion of Irori can spend ki to trigger Lay on hands or Smite Evil. It also states that levels in Champion of Irori stack with Paladin levels to "determine the effect of such abilities."
Can I get some disambiguation on this? What exactly do the class's levels stack to determine in regard to Lay on Hands: dice, #of uses, or both? Do the levels of Champion stack with Paladin for any use of Lay on Hands, or just the ki-powered ones?

My GM, given a "pat self on back" trigger, would have me develop an itch on my back and great need to scratch it, telling me that it might set off the symbol. It is a good idea, not overpowered but I think it better to cover rather than risk a GM ruling on a trigger since it is not an established 'trick'. I don't know about using a big banner or anything, your GM might rule that properly unfurling a 5'x5' square of cloth takes more than one round, a shield (or tabard) should be prominent enough, perhaps you can get a ruling from your GM without giving the trick away by asking about holy symbols.

My GM's not THAT sadistic to give me crippling itchy-back...I don't think.... Maybe I'll tell him I'm brewing up a game for some other friends and I'm making the first boss use one of the less powerful offensive ones in a similar manner, and see what he says about that. I've come to him with GM questions before, so it shouldn't give me away too badly.

well don't scratch your back by mistake when you are looking at you cloak/robe. A better way might be to have it placed on your shield and covered by a flap of leather, set to trigger when touched - pull up flap and touch symbol to activate. As long as it is covered then it cannot activate so no need for a complicated activation sequence.

Well if I read Symbol of Death right, and the trigger works the same, I can add a command word with the touch to activate it. And as for "prominent location", that's why I was going to get a really big piece of cloth, like the size of a big rug/carpet, since I figured the symbol would be visually similar to a complex runic circle/design, so I'd need a lot of room (at least a 5ftx5ft square when unrolled). I would check with my GM, but this is one of those maneuvers that I kinda want to surprise him with ;)

Actually, I'm almost certain the next dungeon we're going to is going to be chock full of undead, and I figured the symbol would be a good "oh crap button" if we get into trouble. I know most of the time, these symbols are only effective when used as traps or with a lot of setup, but with the high concentration of undead my group's been running into lately, a little insurance seemed necessary :P

So just scribe it onto my cloak/robes and give myself a pat on the back if we get overrun by zombies?

I'm working on a Cleric, and he recently got his level 3 spells. Among them is Symbol of Healing. I have an idea for a neat trick I'd like to do with it, and I want to know if/how it'd work. Here goes:
1- buy a large tarp or cloth
2- scribe said Symbol on said cloth
3-Fold/roll up cloth and put in bag
4- when needed, unfold/unroll the cloth and activate the Symbol

If the triggering mechanism is similar to Symbol of Death, then I can make it something like "trigger when I put both hands on the symbol and say the magic words" when I initially scribe it right?

Is this fair game, and what kind of actions would it take to deploy the emergency symbol from a mechanical standpoint while in combat, and while out of it?
Any tips from fellow Clerics on how to have an emergency Symbol to deploy, if possible would be appreciated as well. (I'm assuming just scribing it on my weapon or something is no good, since it must be clearly visible from 60 feet away.)

Honestly, when I read Dimensional Savant, it seemed like a fun feat to cap off a bard/rogue building into Arcane Trickster. The "flank all the things" aspect of Dimensional Savant looks like it'd better benefit a magical character with sneak attack or another class feature that benefits from the flanking itself. That, or as a silly way to help out a party where everyone else is a rogue.

Get her a stone familiar

The rules of the Prestige Class say the new familiar's a cacodaemon, no ifs/ands/buts.

Yeah our DM was going to rule in favor of keeping her spells anyway, I think, but I was just digging for clarification on just how much that "the souleater is not penalized for the lost familiar" line covered here.

In our weekly Pathfinder game, we're doing Way of the Wicked, and one our players is a witch that wants to take Souleater as a prestige class. Here's where we're scratching our heads:

Whenever you take that first level of Souleater, your new cacodaemon familiar devours your old familiar. However, since a witch's familiar is effectively her spellbook, does she then have to spend time and money teaching the daemon her spells? Or, does the line about "not penalizing the caster" also mean that the cacodaemon "absorbs" all the old familiar's spells?
Cacodaemon Familiar
I think our DM's going to rule that since:
a)Cacodaemons eat souls
and
b)The Horseman she's intending to choose has a similar portfolio to her Witch Patron
That her new familiar will absorb the old, but a little more clarification would be helpful in the decision.

Does that mean you can take 10 on one of your chosen skills in combat? If so, Champion of Irori+Snake Style's feats seems snazzy.

Probably a silly question, but:
I'm assuming any other active bonuses to AC are ignored when you roll the Snake Style check? (ie: your armor, dodge/shield bonuses, etc.)

Oh that's fancy. Makes me less scared of taking Radiant Charge as a feat later.

On a related note, could a smaller druid like a Gnome or Halfling ride, say, a dog or wolf animal companion?

This may be a silly question, but I was looking over the entry for Champion of Irori and I need something cleared up.
It says that "a champion of Irori may expend 2 ki points to trigger either his lay on hands ability (if he has it) or his smite evil ability."

Does this mean that a ki-fueled LoH or Smite doesn't consume one of my daily uses and/or I can use ki to activate one of these abilities even if I'm out of regular ones for the day?
If this isn't the case, what is the difference between triggering one of these abilities with ki and using it normally? Keep in mind I'm still a little bit new to this, I was just sort of snooping around to see what I might want to do a few levels down the road with the Paladin I'm playing.

Hey all! I played my 1st game of Pathfinder at a convention recently, and I had a ton of fun. However, I'm not sure if I'll get to play that particular campaign (Legends of the Shining Jewel) very often, since I don't actually get to go to many conventions and I don't think anyone in my hometown plays it. Is it possible to move this character to another setting/campaign in Pathfinder, or not? If not, I'd like to find other Legends of the Shining Jewel players in or near Owensboro KY to start or join a game with.