Splinter Spell Resistance and Magus / Spell Storing spells


Rules Questions


So, let's say you have a magus or a spell storing weapon with shocking grasp that has Splinter Spell Resistance.

Which spells would the target be affected by first or is it at the decision of the wielder?

I.e. My player would like the Splinter Spell Resistance to affect the target before the Shocking grasp spell


Splinter Spell Resistance:T2 targets the weapon(not the hit foe), so you'd want to cast it before the attack.
Be aware that spell storage items release the spell at minimum CL & DC as it's Game Balance against "spell in a can" & spell(power) storage. Some Home Game GMs rule around this.

Spell Combat, Spell Strike, and holding a touch spell have their own mechanics. It can get confusing (many threads on it) so make sure you understand RAW. Everything is simultaneous on a hit then riders affect damaged targets. A GM is in control of the details but often it's Player's choice when it comes to simultaneous effects. Some things have an order, like Energy Rst with DR last or metamagics with minimal(least favorable) results.


Azothath wrote:

Splinter Spell Resistance:T2 targets the weapon(not the hit foe), so you'd want to cast it before the attack.

Be aware that spell storage items release the spell at minimum CL & DC as it's Game Balance against "spell in a can" & spell(power) storage. Some Home Game GMs rule around this.

Spell Combat, Spell Strike, and holding a touch spell have their own mechanics. It can get confusing (many threads on it) so make sure you understand RAW. Everything is simultaneous on a hit then riders affect damaged targets. A GM is in control of the details but often it's Player's choice when it comes to simultaneous effects. Some things have an order, like Energy Rst with DR last or metamagics with minimal(least favorable) results.

So there's no official ruling when two spells affect the target in any particular order?

The Exchange

You are correct that there's no "official ruling spelling out the interaction timing of these two effects." Not just for this particular situation. There are no general rulings on what order to resolve a "stack" of effects that happen more or less simultaneously or interrupt each other. So the GM has to go with what makes the most sense.

Most GMs digging into the text are probably going to rule that with Spell Storing the Splinter Spell Resistance happens first, because of the exact wording. The splintering happens instantly on damage, the Spell Storing cast is an action (free action, but still an action) so the splintering would have resolved first.

Splinter Spell Resistance wrote:
The first time each round the weapon damages a creature with spell resistance, that creature’s spell resistance is reduced by 5 for 1 round.
Spell Storing wrote:
Anytime the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action

Magus is less clear.

Magus Spellstrike wrote:
If successful, this melee attack deals its normal damage as well as the effects of the spell.

If I want to be really pedantic I could argue that the spellstrike effect happens simultaneously with the damage while the splintering doesn't happen until the creature has taken the damage. How I would actually rule is that they are all basically simultaneous, so choose your own order. Which is going to be splinter first, then spellstrike, for every PC and NPC. That also keeps it consistent with Spell Storing.

The Exchange

Azothath wrote:
Be aware that spell storage items release the spell at minimum CL & DC as it's Game Balance against "spell in a can" & spell(power) storage. Some Home Game GMs rule around this.

For Spell Storing weapons, the official ruling setting the spell to minimum CL and DC was PFS-specific. There was no overall Pathfinder ruling.

While a Ring of Spell Storing does say the spell is cast at minimum CL, the Spell Storing weapon quality does not have the same language. It's been a point of debate since PF1 came out.


you have to read the weapon spell storing quality (+1) for exactly how it goes off and whom it targets. Splinter Spell Resistance isn't appropriate, Intensified Shocking Grasp is. The problem is the wording in Splinter Spell Resistance with the spell storage text. Tgt tch is in your favor but not the effect. It could buff your foes weapon in hand. Historically touch spells damage foes but Splinter Spell Resistance doesn't have that simplicity. Rule Lawyer mode as this is Rules Forum.

I'm aware of the PFS Spell Storing rulings and tried to be clear. It's GM dependent as in the wild I've seen it go both ways. Depends on which text influences what process... lol, I've never seen accurate RAW in a Home Game - it is always tweaked and there are enough corner cases to make that common if not practical. Then again I can push boundaries...


A spell storing weapon allows a spellcaster to store a single targeted spell of up to 3rd level in the weapon. (The spell must have a casting time of 1 standard action.) Anytime the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action if the wielder desires. (This special ability is an exception to the general rule that casting a spell from an item takes at least as long as casting that spell normally.) Once the spell has been cast from the weapon, a spellcaster can cast any other targeted spell of up to 3rd level into it. The weapon magically imparts to the wielder the name of the spell currently stored within it. A randomly rolled spell storing weapon has a 50% chance of having a spell stored in it already. This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons

Spell storing specifies that to cast the spell you must hit and damage the target. It also specifies it is a free action to cast the spell even though it says you can immediately cast the spell. That makes it clear that immediately is using the English definition and not the game term. That means the spell is being cast after the weapon hits and the damage is determined. Splinter resistance does not require any kind of action to take effect, so it is considered part of the attack action to hit the target. Since the only things that can interrupt an action are an immediate action or a readied action splinter resistance would take effect before the shocking grasp is cast.

Spellstrike (Su): At 2nd level, whenever a magus casts a spell with a range of “touch” from the magus spell list, he can deliver the spell through any weapon he is wielding as part of a melee attack. Instead of the free melee touch attack normally allowed to deliver the spell, a magus can make one free melee attack with his weapon (at his highest base attack bonus) as part of casting this spell. If successful, this melee attack deals its normal damage as well as the effects of the spell. If the magus makes this attack in concert with spell combat, this melee attack takes all the penalties accrued by spell combat melee attacks. This attack uses the weapon's critical range (20, 19–20, or 18–20 and modified by the keen weapon property or similar effects), but the spell effect only deals ×2 damage on a successful critical hit, while the weapon damage uses its own critical modifier.

Spellstrike is a totally different situation. Spellstrike specifies that the attack is part of casting the spell, not a separate action. So, the damage from spell strike occurs at the same time as the weapon damage.

You create an aura around the target weapon that weakens a foe’s magical defenses. The first time each round the weapon damages a creature with spell resistance, that creature’s spell resistance is reduced by 5 for 1 round. This reduction is not cumulative for multiple attacks within the same round, even if the target is struck by different weapons, each affected by a different casting of splinter spell resistance. However, the same creature’s spell resistance can be reduced on multiple rounds by subsequent hits.

Splinter resistance specifies that it lowers the resistance after the first time the weapon damages the target. Since the damage from spellstrike occurs at the same time as the weapon damage shocking grasps will take effect before splinter resistance.

There is no need for a general rule on which spell takes effect first in this case because both situations have specific circumstances that would override any general rule.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Splinter Spell Resistance and Magus / Spell Storing spells All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Rules Questions