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I'm proposing an addition to the Swashbuckler Archetype to make it more mechanically satisfying and better aligned with the design philosophy of Pathfinder 2E. Here's the new feature:
Stylish Combatant (Archetype)
While you already have panache and are in a combat encounter, you gain a +1 circumstance bonus to skill checks with the bravado trait. Additionally, while you have panache, you gain a +5-foot status bonus to your Speeds.
Design Justification
As written, the Swashbuckler Dedication grants:
Training in one of two skills based on your chosen style — a weaker benefit compared to most dedications, where a skill training is typically a bonus on top of a more defining feature.
The ability to Gain Panache — which, by RAW, is functionally empty unless the character spends additional feats to do anything with it.
This second point is my biggest concern. Granting the ability to gain panache without any accompanying effect is essentially like giving a character spellcasting but no cantrips, spell slots, or focus spells — just a label with no substance. This feels contrary to 2E’s design philosophy, which generally avoids "empty" abilities and feat taxes.
On the New Feature
Initially, I considered omitting the circumstance bonus to bravado checks. But after reflection, I decided to make it conditional on already having panache. This design:
Encourages the archetype user to engage in bravado-style actions to gain and maintain panache.
Preserves a distinction between archetype users and full Swashbucklers. The class Swashbuckler gains their circumstance bonus to Bravado skills even before they have panache, giving them an edge in gaining it in the first place.
Helps archetype characters maintain panache longer and gain modest combat utility from it, without overshadowing the full class.
It’s similar in spirit to how Archetype Barbarians get a weaker version of Rage — they get the flavor, but not the full power.
Potential Concerns – Looking for Feedback
Is the +1 circumstance bonus to Bravado skills while in panache too strong? I don’t think so, but I’m open to hearing why it might be.
Is the conditional +5-foot status bonus to speed too much? Again, I feel this is fair. The Swashbuckler class gets a higher bonus and can invest in feats to increase it further. The archetype's speed bonus is locked behind having panache, and future feats are still required for improvements or for gaining Precise Strike and Finishers.
Class Swashbucklers get:
Panache that grants Precise Strike, access to Finishers, a movement speed bonus, and passive bonuses to Bravado skills.
Higher-level upgrades to that speed bonus, including a passive portion even when not in panache.
By contrast, this archetype version:
Provides only the speed bonus while in panache and a minor bonus to Bravado skill checks, and only when panache is already active.
Requires feat investment to unlock even a weaker Precise Strike or any further increased speed benefits.
I believe this strikes the right balance: flavorful and functional, but clearly a watered-down version from the full class. It gives panache meaning for archetype users, without stepping on the toes of full Swashbucklers.
Background Context:
I’m running a Free Archetype game, and one of my players picked Swashbuckler. Up until now, I’d only let them benefit from the speed bonus while they had panache. Going forward, I’m planning to also allow the Bravado bonus whenever they already have panache, to give it a bit more utility and feel like the archetype choice is paying off.
Thoughts?
I'd love feedback from others. Do you feel this adjusted version is too generous? Too conservative? Does it align well with other archetypes in terms of power and feel?
I'm in favor of this. As the OP mentions, it's really strange for the dedication feat to let you gain panache but offer no benefits for it, and on its own the feat just offers two trained skills, which is terrible. If we want to be really cautious, I'd just add the +5 Speed bonus while having panache and keep it at that, but a +1 circumstance bonus to those bravado skills would make the feat pretty decent.
This is probably something for another thread, but a recurring issue I have with dedication feats is that their wording is often needlessly repetitive and their power budget feels wasted on trained skills instead of the stuff people want from an archetype. Because the prerequisites are based on attributes, multiclass dedications are also generally either trivially easy to access without any initial commitment other than the feat, or are effectively impossible to fit into a build without an awkward stat array. I'd gladly take a Swashbuckler Dedication that required me to be trained in the two relevant bravado skills instead of the required attributes if it meant I gained a bit more of what makes the class interesting, even if it meant not getting those trained skills.
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So you interpret the Dedication as granting two trained skills? Because I read it as granting only one. Which was also part of my weighting that made gaining Panache being empty being too bad to be true.
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You become trained in Acrobatics or the skill associated with your style.
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Oh crap, I misread that! Good grief, it's even worse than I thought. At that point, one way to go about it could be to just roll Finishing Precision into the dedication, so you could already start spending panache.