Cyclonic Ascent - Underwater

[Weyrsinger]

I was playing a game and we ended up doing underwater combat and we needed someone to move quickly. I was under the effect of Cyclonic Ascent and felt that I should be able to use that to move full speed since according to the description of Kinetic Gate:
"Your kinetic elements function even in environments where they normally wouldn't. For example, you could use fire actions underwater even though that's normally not possible, and you could create air in a vacuum."

This should mean that I am able to create air/bubbles that push me through the water, yes? Kineticists get to do a lot of otherwise impossible things, and at least this one makes sense to me (especially since I am an Air/Water Kineticist, though I know that does not make a difference rules-wise). What do y'all think?

*We ended up ruling it as possible for this game with more research to follow.

[breithauptclan]

Well, you can run it in your game however your table decides to. Nothing wrong with that.

As far as the rules go, I don't think that works. Cyclonic Ascent gives you a fly speed. As a Kineticist could you use the ability underwater - probably. What a fly speed means underwater, I am not sure. But it probably doesn't mean that you swim through the water however you want. That is what a swim speed does.

For a Water Kineticist dealing with underwater combat, you would want Return to the Sea. Which would give the swim speed that you need.

For class balance, Kineticist is the blaster caster that a lot of people have been wanting for a long time. A character that has combat spells all day with no resource cost. The tradeoff is that they lose the utility spells and stop being the toolbox caster that Wizard, Druid, Witch, etc are.

Now, if your party doesn't have a Druid that you are stomping all over the toes of - then like I said at the beginning, run it the way that is fun for your table. But as a general ruling of the game rules for a public forum on the internet, no. Cyclonic Ascent does not give a swim speed. If you want a swim speed, use Return to the Sea, or cast Feet to Fins directly, or use any of the other many ways of getting a swim speed.

[YuriP]

I agree with the cat. Cyclonic Ascent gives you a fly speed this doesn't affect other speeds like Burrow Speed and Swim Speed. It also doesn't affect your Land Speed and Climb Speed but these speed could be easily ignored because you can fly just some feets/centimeters above the surface and don't use them at all.