| Bellona |
I have some questions about a particular race/class/archetype combination and how it interacts both with its own class features and with certain feats. Seeing as how part of the Polymorph sub-school's description seems to boil down to "GM discretion", I'm asking the forum's communal mind for opinions. :)
One of my players has a dwarven character, a Druid wtih the goliath archetype (PC: Giant Hunter's Handbook). He spends most of his adventuring time in a wild shaped giant form - usually as a troll or ettin. Currently, he's only using the Alter Self version of wild shape (available from goliath Druid 6+). Later on he'll get the Giant Form I and Giant Form II versions.
Should his Goblin Cleaver feat (ARG) still be usable while he's wild shaped? The feat requires that the user is a dwarf. (The same question goes for the rest of that feat tree.)
Other questions revolve around what abilities are gained/lost by using wild shape. The basic spell descriptions are clear about what is/is not gained. The troll form cannot use Rend or Regeneration yet. (Those have to wait for the Giant Form spell-equivalents.) Likewise, I'm pretty sure that the ettin form's Superior Two-Weapon Fighting special attack is not given by any of the wild shape spell-equivalents (Alter Self, Giant Form I, Giant Form II).
According to the Polymorph sub-school's description, the dwarf's unadjusted 20' movement speed is replaced by the troll's 30' speed or the ettin's 40' speed. However, I feel that the wild shaped dwarf should lose both the Slow and Steady and the Stability racial traits, as they are connected with a dwarf's natural speed and build. (The same goes for the dwarf while in dinosaur/megafaun form.)
I'm also looking at the dwarven Hardy racial trait. How much of it is bound up in the dwarf's phyically dwarven form and how much of it is somehow innate to his very being? Ditto for the Steel Soul feat (APG), which requires the user to both be a dwarf and to have the Hardy racial trait. Or the Glory of Old region trait from Five Kings Mountains (Dwarves of Golarion)?
What about Dwarven Weapon Familiarity? Defensive Training? Or abilities like Stonecunning and Greed - how good is the short range vision of either giants or dinosaurs/megafauna when it comes to specialised skill checks like those?
The Hatred racial trait seems to be hardwired psychologically into dwarves, so I'd be reluctant to remove that from the wild shaped dwarf.
| Melkiador |
The character is still a dwarf. Polymorph doesn't change your type. The racial abilities are more tricky though.
While under the effects of a polymorph spell, you lose all extraordinary and supernatural abilities that depend on your original form (such as keen senses, scent, and darkvision), as well as any natural attacks and movement types possessed by your original form.
It's very unclear which abilities depend on your original form and which are mentally tied to the character. Slow and Steady and Darkvision are obviously lost. The others are up to GM decision. Personally, I'd only remove those two, but I'm sure others will argue for removing them all.
| Derklord |
Only physical stuff is lost. Defensive Training, Greed, Hatred, Stonecunning, Weapon Familiarity, and Languages have nothing to do with having a dwarf body, but rather are form growing up in dwarf culture, being polymorphed doesn't affect them. In Pathfinder, your mind is de facto independent from your physical brain. That's just how it works.
Meanwhile, Slow and Steady, Darkvision, and Hardy are all results of the dwarf's physical body, and are thus lost when polymorphing.
Stability could be either one (training or lower center of gravity, or training). I'd put it in the mental category, personally.
One thing I think is helpful is look at what racial traits can be taken in replacement of a racial trait in question. Doesn't always work, but can be an indication. For example, the three direct replacements for Stability all seem to be mental, which indicates Stability is so, too.
Likewise, I'm pretty sure that the ettin form's Superior Two-Weapon Fighting special attack is not given by any of the wild shape spell-equivalents (Alter Self, Giant Form I, Giant Form II).
Yes, nothing is ever gained unless explicitly said.
GM: Dwarves lose their +2 bonus to resist poisons.
Player: My dwarf becomes a human to experience what being drunk is like.
As if any self-respecting dwarf would consider alcohol a poison! Clearly, the racial trait doesn't work to begin with!
Are there even any default rules on drunkenness where the racial traits prevents getting drunk? When using the alternate rules from Inner Sea Taverns, the racial trait would help dwarfs keep drinking after becoming "soused".
| AwesomenessDog |
Nothing that prevents getting drunk outright except perhaps poison immunity, but it is called alcohol *poisoning* for a reason. Technically alcohol falls under the drug rules tho, so even if we allow the "+2 Fort save vs. poison" be treated liked an additional +2 Con Mod, that means that they are only able to drink 4 more averagely alcoholic beverages before they are affected, and doesn't change how fast they "sober" through their consumed beverages (at a rate of 1 drink/hr).
Just like drugs, alcohol can be abused and have significant negative effects. In general, a character can consume a number of alcoholic beverages equal to 1 plus double his Constitution modifier before being sickened for 1 hour equal to the number of drinks above this maximum. Particularly exotic or strong forms of alcohol might be treated as normal drugs. Those who regularly abuse alcohol might eventually develop a moderate addiction.