Reapply combat grab fighter

[zuzmo]

I want to build a fighter with one handed weapon and i encountered this issue:

If I succeed on combat grab, i have no free hand for snagging strike, combat grab next round. So they enemy automatically escape at the end of my second turn.

Anyone have a good solution to keep enemy grabbed?

[yellowpete]

On the second turn, Strike/Trip, Release, then Combat Grab.

[Ascalaphus]

Yeah that's an okay solution. Trip can at least keep them flat-footed and if you don't manage to reapply the combat grab, you could still get an AoO if they get up. And if you do manage to reapply, standing up is a move action and grab causes immobilize, so they first have to escape before they can stand up. Pretty nasty.

[SuperBidi]

yellowpete wrote:

On the second turn, Strike/Trip, Release, then Combat Grab.

There's no "release" action to end a grab per strict RAW (and I don't know if it's intended). To achieve the same result, I only see one way: moving.

Otherwise, if you want to extend the duration of a grapple, you can just take the grapple action again and if you succeed it extends the grapple by one round.

[breithauptclan]

The requirements for Grapple are that you either have a free hand, or you are already grappling your opponent.

Yes it is strict RAW that if you are grappling an opponent, then that hand is not free. Which is intended for preventing things like drawing a second weapon after initiating a grapple.

Grapple itself has an exception. The fact that Combat Grab doesn't seems like an oversight similar to the initial rules text for Animal Form that wouldn't allow you to use Escape because it has the Attack trait.

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However, if the GM doesn't go for that ruling, the other option is to free action Release the target before using the combat maneuver attacks.

If you are holding an enemy in your otherwise free hand and that is what is preventing you from doing grapple maneuvers, then it is pretty strict RAW that Release:

Release wrote:

You release something you're holding in your hand or hands. This might mean dropping an item, removing one hand from your weapon while continuing to hold it in another hand, releasing a rope suspending a chandelier, or performing a similar action.

would allow you to drop the enemy that you are holding.

[SuperBidi]

breithauptclan wrote:

However, if the GM doesn't go for that ruling, the other option is to free action Release the target before using the combat maneuver attacks.

If you are holding an enemy in your otherwise free hand and that is what is preventing you from doing grapple maneuvers, then it is pretty strict RAW that Release:

Release wrote:

You release something you're holding in your hand or hands. This might mean dropping an item, removing one hand from your weapon while continuing to hold it in another hand, releasing a rope suspending a chandelier, or performing a similar action.

would allow you to drop the enemy that you are holding.

Release doesn't apply to grapple. Neither RAW (you don't hold something in your hand when you grapple someone) nor RAI (as it's obviously intended for items).

Allowing Release to end a grapple is definitely a houserule (and I have no opinion on it).

[breithauptclan]

SuperBidi wrote:

Release doesn't apply to grapple.

Release does not list holding enemies in your hand as an exception.

It doesn't specify that the action applies only to items, it is just that the examples it lists are all objects. One of which (the rope suspending the chandelier) isn't even something that you could carry around. So you are still 'holding' the object according to the rules for Release even if you aren't 'carrying' or 'wielding' the object.

And an example list isn't necessarily exhaustive.

SuperBidi wrote:

Neither RAW (you don't hold something in your hand when you grapple someone)

If you are not holding the enemy in your hand, then the hand that you are grappling with is still free. Which doesn't make a lot of sense.

[Kyle_TheBuilder]

zuzmo wrote:

I want to build a fighter with one handed weapon and i encountered this issue:

If I succeed on combat grab, i have no free hand for snagging strike, combat grab next round. So they enemy automatically escape at the end of my second turn.

Anyone have a good solution to keep enemy grabbed?

First of all I agree above that you can Release grappled enemy. No matter how I look at it, it wouldn't make sense if you couldn't.

As for your question:

At second turn use Knockdown on them if you have weapon with Trip (this way you can ingore free-hand requirement) to Strike + Trip and Release them and get AoO from them Standing.

You can also take Wrestler dedication for Whirling Throw and after first turn you can you Snagging->Combat Grab->Whirling Throw or you if you have no action left, start next turn with Trip->Whriling Throw->Stride to thrown enemy->get AoO from them standing or just Strike->Strike->Whirling Throw.

If you like to Grapple as Fighter you can combine him with Martial Artist (which lets you get both your Fighter Weapon group and unnarmed to scale together) for 1d6 unarmed, get Handwraps, take Wrestler and bum! You have better monk and you can grapple with combat grab and do all sort of "crushing" manouvers with Wrestler or throw them around battlefield.

Best is you can still use your Fighter weapon group if needed so you can combine weapon + unarmed for Wrestler grappling/crushing/striking since most Wrestler feats are unarmed Strikes.

But that's only if you play with Free Archetype, as otherwise it's impossible to pull off in reasonable level range.