Ok, so basically as the title says, I'm building a spear 'fighter' that focuses on creating an area of debilitating attrition and be a bulwark for my allies against assault, or wear down and interfere with opponent that get close.
I've got a general build idea in place, but I'm looking if I've over looked anything or people can help tool this a bit to improve the concept. Or even provide equipment suggestions.
So my build say is at lvl 10 currently, including 2 tiers of mythic.
I've taken 9 Levels of Fighter-Dragonheir Scion (didn't take other 'reach' fighters because they gave up weapon trainings and the like)
1 level of Samurai-Warrior Poet.
The build is based around having 15 base reach with an Elven Branched spear thanks to Mythic power 'Retributive Reach'.
And thanks to the Mythic Ability 'Legendary Item' my spear is a sentient magic item with the power to cast Longarm on me 1/day. (DM approved power)
So 20 base reach.
Then I can take combat patrol to increase my threatened area to 30 ft and move to make AoOs.
Warrior Poet with Petals on the Wind allows me also move 5ft per attack, borrowed from next round's movement.
The concept is I'll move up to strike someone at 30ft that provokes, then move back 5ft, maintaining the distance. (at 25ft)
Mythic Combat Reflexes allows me not only to have unlimited AoOs, I can spend a swift action to make multiple attacks against against people that provoke AoOs from moving, rather than just the once. So I can keep this process up so long as I have move speed banked and mythic points (Move speed being 40)
I'm further stretching the potency of this build with Wolf Style, which, for every 10dmg I deal, burns or saps 5ft of movement from the enemy. Meaning I'm attacking them from extreme distance, falling back, and draining their speed while I do it. Not to mention wolf style says I get a free trip attempt when I burn their speed to zero. Which could then provoke another attack when they try and stand back up. Meaning they lost a move action to stand up, and their speed is already hemorrhaging before they take a step. Either I stop them in their tracks, or get a free trip, both good options.
My spear is enchanted with Fortuitious so when I make an AoO I can make a second AoO at -5ab. (so basically an iterative attack, but on every AoO)
I also am thinking of taking the 'Training' Enchantment on my spear, which lets me select a combat feat 1/day to know as a move action, and was thinking improved trip (since I don't have it) or something else useful. (Open to suggestions to bank, situationally and generally)
While not damage heavy, this build has a lot of damage potential is set up correctly. My relatively weak dps as a dex fighter is off set by:
Power attack
Possibly the agile weapon property
If I'm not using Mythic Combat Reflexes, Dragonheir Scion gives me Arcane Strike, with a bonus 1d4 elemental damage to the attack.
Warrior Spirit Advanced Weapon Training Allows me to enchant my weapon up to my weapon training bonus (+2) per use, up to +5 so I can stack some enchantments if I have the action economy.
That's the basics of the build foundation.
For added benefit, I have Cut from the Air, which lets me use AoOs against enemy ranged attacks against me or adjacent allies.
Traits that give bonuses to AoOs
So far on my potentials to take are Pushing Strike, so I can push enemies back by 10ft rather than do the damage from a power attack
Improved Trip
Weapon Focus and specializations
Etc.
For the future I did think about taking Oath Against Savagry Paladin, at least 1 level, to gain the ability to expend my Smite to gain an addtional 5ft reach. It'd be like a second longarm per day. Plus I think plant domain and some bloodline powers increase reach temporarily that might be good.
So what do you think? Am I over looking any glaring flaws in this plan, or do you know a way to tool this into being even better? Whether that's feats, items, class features worth a dip, etc. Lets brainstorm!
if you are not overly set out for the Dragonheir Scion might i suggest you change to the Siegebreaker?
with
Breaker Momentum:
At 2nd level, when a siegebreaker successfully bull rushes a foe, he can attempt an overrun combat maneuver check against that foe as a free action. This ability replaces the feat gained at 2nd level.
you can bull rush an enemy, deal damage as per
Breaker Rush:
At 1st level, a siegebreaker can attempt bull rush or overrun combat maneuvers without provoking attacks of opportunity. When he performs either combat maneuver, he deals an amount of bludgeoning damage equal to his Strength bonus (minimum 1). If he has Improved Bull Rush or Improved Overrun, the damage dealt by the appropriate maneuver increases by 2 and he adds any enhancement bonus from his armor or shield (though such enhancement bonuses do not stack, if both armor and shield are magic). This ability replaces the feat gained at 1st level.
, then overrun him to make distance. dealing damage again and possibly knocking him prone for extra attacks depend on your feat's pick.
i had one with power attack, improved over-run. improved bull-rush and Spiked Destroyer (which give an extra attack when you bull rush or overrun as swift action) at level 5.
i guess at level 10 you can grab the greater version of the improved for even more extra aoo.
as long as you can make maneuvers you get to:
bullrush+breaker rush damage (armor or shield enhancement bonus+str+2) then attack with armor spikes (with spiked destroyer) and overrun+breaker rush damage (as above) and using overrun get to distance yourself and maybe knock the target prone which gives an aoo from greater overrun).
The one big problem I see with your idea is the whole big "fall back" side of the plan. I'm not sure how you're doing it. With Petals on the Wind you have to move before you take the attack of opportunity, not after.
Usually a character like this relies on Improved Trip as the core of the build, since tripping lets you effectively halt the enemy's movement. Not effective at all against flying enemies though. (Which I would expect a lot of in a mythic campaign.)
Usually a character like this relies on Improved Trip as the core of the build, since tripping lets you effectively halt the enemy's movement.
You can trip people without Improved Trip, and with a reach weapon you can often avoid the AoO simply by being out of their reach. This means you're only really missing the +2 to hit, and saving yourself 2 feats.
If you plan on doing a LOT of tripping it's probably worth the feats, but if you have other plans then saving 2 feats for a fairly minimal accuracy boost seems like a good idea to me.
The best AOO build is properbly Fauchard wielding Hunter or Sacred Huntsmaster Inquisitor with an animal Companion with a high dex for lots of AOO and reach (Which does not show on the Animal compagnion size increasement. Bipedal should have 10 ft reach when large, and long tails like stegosaurus should have as well, but ask your GM beforehand).
Feats like Outflank, Pack Flanking, Paired Opportunitist, Seize The Moment, Broken Wing Gambit and improved spell sharing.
Ok, so, there should be relatively little stopping you from having a mythic item with like, upgradable X1 and 2time intelligent, picking spell casting twice.
Join the Bloodrager or Alchemist spelllist, which has both enlarge person and longarm.
You could consider stand still stan still or, since you should have the Bab, tripping strike/bullrush strike which makes you bullrush or trip on a crit, iirc including one from AoOs.
Usually a character like this relies on Improved Trip as the core of the build, since tripping lets you effectively halt the enemy's movement.
You can trip people without Improved Trip, and with a reach weapon you can often avoid the AoO simply by being out of their reach. This means you're only really missing the +2 to hit, and saving yourself 2 feats.
If you plan on doing a LOT of tripping it's probably worth the feats, but if you have other plans then saving 2 feats for a fairly minimal accuracy boost seems like a good idea to me.
Did not intend to imply that Improved Trip was required, rather that it was the core of most reach/multiple AoO builds since it is a prerequisite for so many other feats those builds use. (Tripping Strike, Greater Trip, etc.)
Ok, so, there should be relatively little stopping you from having a mythic item with like, upgradable X1 and 2time intelligent, picking spell casting twice.
Join the Bloodrager or Alchemist spelllist, which has both enlarge person and longarm.
You could consider stand still stan still or, since you should have the Bab, tripping strike/bullrush strike which makes you bullrush or trip on a crit, iirc including one from AoOs.
The problem with Stand Still is that it can only be used on adjacent enemies, which kinda defeats the whole purpose of the reach build.
if you are not overly set out for the Dragonheir Scion might i suggest you change to the Siegebreaker?
with ** spoiler omitted **
you can bull rush an enemy, deal damage as per ** spoiler omitted **, then overrun him to make distance. dealing damage again and possibly knocking him prone for extra attacks depend on your feat's pick.
i had one with power attack, improved over-run. improved bull-rush and Spiked Destroyer (which give an extra attack when you bull rush or overrun as swift action) at level 5.
i guess at level 10 you can grab the greater version of the improved for even more extra aoo.
as long as you can make maneuvers you get to:
bullrush+breaker rush damage (armor or shield enhancement bonus+str+2) then attack with armor spikes (with spiked destroyer) and overrun+breaker rush damage (as above) and using overrun get to distance yourself and maybe knock the target prone which gives an aoo from greater overrun). I'm not sure in what ways this stacks with being a reach character.
I see that's a great way to control the field and get AoOs, but how does it mesh with using a spear and keeping foes away from my allies?
The one big problem I see with your idea is the whole big "fall back" side of the plan. I'm not sure how you're doing it. With Petals on the Wind you have to move before you take the attack of opportunity, not after.
Usually a character like this relies on Improved Trip as the core of the build, since tripping lets you effectively halt the enemy's movement. Not effective at all against flying enemies though. (Which I would expect a lot of in a mythic campaign.)
Thank you for that callout on Petals on the Wind. That move does not opperate the way I first read it. I cannot fallback during my combat patrol, until they get within my natural reach. Thank you. Still useful but in a different way.
As for improved trip, not super useful when attacking at reach, but the bonus to the roll would be nice. Considering for a later feat grab.
The best AOO build is properbly Fauchard wielding Hunter or Sacred Huntsmaster Inquisitor with an animal Companion with a high dex for lots of AOO and reach (Which does not show on the Animal compagnion size increasement. Bipedal should have 10 ft reach when large, and long tails like stegosaurus should have as well, but ask your GM beforehand).
Feats like Outflank, Pack Flanking, Paired Opportunitist, Seize The Moment, Broken Wing Gambit and improved spell sharing.
Interesting idea! It's an entirely different build than I'm trying to pull off currently, but it sounds fun enough to try in the future!
Ok, so, there should be relatively little stopping you from having a mythic item with like, upgradable X1 and 2time intelligent, picking spell casting twice.
Join the Bloodrager or Alchemist spelllist, which has both enlarge person and longarm.
You could consider stand still stan still or, since you should have the Bab, tripping strike/bullrush strike which makes you bullrush or trip on a crit, iirc including one from AoOs.
Stand still is definitely a considered feat to take. But because it's only adjacent it's not immediately helpful for my build which is trying to keep people as far away as possible. Probably one I get later down the road.
And my intelligent item was granted longarm by the DM, so If I can just find a source for enlarge person, we golden.
Fortuitious enchantment only works once a round. It is still a powerfull enchantment.
Even so, it's one free AoO with barely a hit to AB at later levels. And it accomplishes the same damage if I hit. Burning the same move speed from enemies. Feels well worth it as a +1 enchant for this build.
Usually a character like this relies on Improved Trip as the core of the build, since tripping lets you effectively halt the enemy's movement. Not effective at all against flying enemies though. (Which I would expect a lot of in a mythic campaign.)
As for improved trip, not super useful when attacking at reach, but the bonus to the roll would be nice. Considering for a later feat grab.
I should have been clearer when I said that Improved Trip was the "core" of many big reach-AoO builds. They start with Improved Trip, but take other feats that have that as a prerequisite - Greater Trip at a minimum.
Your idea is to continually make attacks as the enemy moves towards you, doing damage each time. However it can be avoided if the enemy simply decides not to move towards you. Like a caster or ranged attacker, or even a melee finding another target. The trip build's idea is to force the enemies into positions where they can't avoid the AoOs. It shuts down melee, forces casters to try casting defensively, and kills archers.
Oh, you move towards me? I trip you, then take my damaging AoO from Greater Trip. Getting up? That provokes, take another AoO. My turn. I'll trip you, take my AoO from Greater, then finish my iteratives with a +4 bonus for you being prone.
Oh, you didn't want to move in on me? I'll move until you're 5' inside my threatened area, then trip you. And take my AoO. Why not at my maximum reach? Because now you'll provoke by standing up, a 5' step or withdraw won't get you out of my threatened area, and if you take a move action to get outside my threatened area that provokes another trip.
The classic non-mythic example:
An 11th-level crossblooded bloodrager (aberrant/abyssal). Choosing Demonic Bulk at 4th and Abnormal Reach at 8th gives a reach of 15'. Casting longarm when entering bloodrage makes it 20'. The bloodrager moves to put a melee opponent without reach at exactly 15' and trips him. This opponent is now hosed. Standing up eats one move action (and provokes). Taking a move action to move provokes another trip, putting him right back where he started. 5' stepping gets him neither out of the threatened area or close enough to attack. If he tries 5' stepping closer the bloodrager 5' steps back, trips, and takes his iteratives, putting the enemy prone at 15' again. And every trip provokes an AoO from Greater Trip.
The only ways out of the loop are to succeed at an Acrobatics roll to move through a threatened area, have the bloodrager miss the trip, some relevant class ability or feat, or have a magical way to escape. The last one is pretty hard since he would need to cast defensively or use an item. And the bloodrager is going to try to sunder any potion the enemy pulls out of his pack.
