Medium mount for Small Cavalier - Possible?


Rules Discussion


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From what I have read RAW it looks like it is impossible.

Cavalier Dedication states:
1. You must choose an young animal at least one size larger
2. You CAN chose a SMALL animal and adjust the size to MEDIUM*

*means if you are a SMALL character you could select a SMALL animal to serve as your mount. (goblin with rough rider could select a wolf and the SMALL animal would be MEDIUM and ridable)

Impressive mount (perhaps an essential feat for a rider if you want better action economy and survivability) states:

1. Your mount BECOMES mature (which increases it's size if Medium or smaller)
2. Not that you can chose a new mature mount (MEDIUM sized wolf for example)
2. It also doesn't explicitly state that this does/doesn't stack with the cavalier increase

IF the mature size increase DOES stack with the cavalier exception it means that a small rider could never ride an "impressive" mount of MEDIUM size. Why would the rules force you to have a LARGE mount if you don't want/need one?

Is there an official comment from the Paizo team on this?

RAI it should be possible to have a SMALL rider on an impressive MEDIUM mount as it just makes sense. Is it valid to interpret the rules in either of the following ways:

A: Impressive Mount would allow you to choose a Mature Wolf (MEDIUM) which would not be subject to the Cavalier's Small mount size increase.
OR
B: That when your SMALL mount becomes impressive that the size of that mount would be MEDIUM by default and thus not trigger the cavalier size increase?

If you still want a LARGE mount there is always the savage advancement...


I don't really see the problem here. Why can't a Small character ride on a Large or Huge creature again?

Mounted Combat says:

Mounted Combat wrote:
You can ride some creatures into combat. As noted in the Mount specialty basic action, your mount needs to be at least one size larger than you and willing.

So, it says that it has to be a minimum of one size larger than you. If it's more than that, it is still beyond that minimum threshold established both there and confirmed in the Mount basic action's requirements:

Mount wrote:
Requirements You are adjacent to a creature that is at least one size larger than you and is willing to be your mount.

This means you can still ride a Large-sized creature as a Small-sized character. As such, I don't see how having a creature two sizes larger than you instead of one size creates an issue with mounting or dismounting.

If this is strictly about not taking up more space than a singular Medium creature (and making it more feasible for traversing of narrow areas), then the solution is still simple enough that no errata is needed: Spend downtime to replace your starter Medium-sized companion with a starter Small-sized companion, which grows to Medium with the Impressive Mount feat.

And that's just adhering to strict RAW, a GM is probably more than happy to handwave it, since growing in size does nothing but adjust the amount of squares they take up as well as potential reach for attacks (which is essentially superfluous for most mounts).


Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
I don't really see the problem here. Why can't a Small character ride on a Large or Huge creature again?

Space. The physically number of hexes the mount takes up.

Its a really basic error from Paizo and it is annoying that they don't address it. The rules force you to take an extra size increase.

As it stands technically you have to swap mounts or take an animal companion via another feat chain to avoid having a mount that is a size larger than you need. The other options like Beastmaster don't force the rideability from the start. Its a real pest if you actually wanted the flavour of a Cavalier.

Yes most GMs are reasonable about it, but there are a large portion of them who like to play the rules straight down the line and won't.


From a RAW perspective it looks like you're right. Though, if I was the GM I'd probably allow it to not grow when becoming mature as long as the companion's base size is at least one smaller than it is now.

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