Spellcasting Key Abilities & Multiclass

[DatFatRaccoon]

I bet this is something easy I've missed but I want to get everyone's vote on it to be certain I have it right.

Let's say a player has spellcasting from their Class (Sorc), and another from an Archetype (Wiz). Sorc's Key ability is Charisma, and what they use to cast spells. Wizard's Key is Intelligence.

When casting spells, my understanding rules as written is that the spellcasting modifier they use would be Charisma regardless if they're casting Wizard spells or Sorc spells, because the magic is coming from their "class" even though it's a Feat. (Core pg. 447 "If your Class grants you spellcasting, use your key ability modifier.")

I'm clarifying this interpretation is correct, would make things a lot simpler for me and my players. I'm struggling with it a lot given previous rules systems I learned growing up. Thank you!

[Blave]

The Wizard spells use Int for ther spell attack and DC.

The Wizard Dedication says

Quote:

Your key spellcasting ability for wizard archetype spells is Int, and they are arcane wizard spells.

Can't access my CRB right now so I'm not sure what the quote on page 447 is referring to. If you provide a link to the relevant rule onArchives of Nethys, I'll take a look.

[Castilliano]

Incorrect. The Wizard Archetype clarifies this:
"Your key spellcasting ability for wizard archetype spells is Int,..."

Similar language is used for other Archetypes. This means Archetypes are best used for spells that don't have a save DC and don't Counteract (both of which you'd want w/ your highest stat & proficiency, though you could take an Archetype which uses both the same ones and bypasses this issue). That leaves a lot of room for other uses, like defense, buffs, or utility.

[DatFatRaccoon]

Castilliano wrote:

Incorrect. The Wizard Archetype clarifies this:

"Your key spellcasting ability for wizard archetype spells is Int,..."

Similar language is used for other Archetypes. This means Archetypes are best used for spells that don't have a save DC and don't Counteract (both of which you'd want w/ your highest stat & proficiency, though you could take an Archetype which uses both the same ones and bypasses this issue). That leaves a lot of room for other uses, like defense, buffs, or utility.

Ok, that's good to know, though the Roll 20 sheet seems to not like it. We'll survive though!

Follow up question, would any Familiar gained from Basic Arcana also use the Int as the 'Spellcasting Ability Modifier' when determining Skill modifiers?

[Blave]

I don't think familiars are too intertwined with any spellcasting ability, since you can also get them from ancestries or non-spellcasting classes/archetypes. So I'd personally let the player choose.

That being said, it would probably be Int by RAW.

[Papa Svirf]

DatFatRaccoon wrote:

the Roll 20 sheet seems to not like it.

You can set each spell to have different ability modifiers. Since you won't have too many spells programmed for your Archetype, it shouldn't be much work.

My Champion/Cleric has a Charisma of 08 but a Wisdom of 18 so his Divine spell DCs are 5 apart depending on which spell he's using ^_^

[DatFatRaccoon]

Papa Svirf wrote:

DatFatRaccoon wrote:

the Roll 20 sheet seems to not like it.

You can set each spell to have different ability modifiers. Since you won't have too many spells programmed for your Archetype, it shouldn't be much work.

My Champion/Cleric has a Charisma of 08 but a Wisdom of 18 so his Divine spell DCs are 5 apart depending on which spell he's using ^_^

Oh! Can you give me more clarification on this? I have trouble with Cantrips for instance still using Spell Attack Rolls with the original spellcasting class' modifier, so I've had to plug "@{Class1_modifier}-@{Class2_modifier}" into the Other section for accurate spell attack rolls.