Spellcaster Barbarian

[Waldham]

Hello, I want to create a spellcasting Barbarian.

A Cliffscale Lizardfolk with Undine as versatile heritage.

A picture for the idea about the character :
Quetzalcoatl

0/An imperial dragon for the wings with feathers for the dragon instinct ? (sky dragon)

1/Is it necessary to take spellcasting archetype (as the wizard archetype) before to take Magaambyan Attendant Dedication [2] (not necesseray for halcyon speaker), and then Halcyon Speaker Dedication [6], Halcyon Spellcasting Initiate [10], Flexible Halcyon Spellcasting [12], Halcyon Spellcasting Adept [14], Halcyon Spellcasting Sage [18] ?

For the spells, I think about controlled battlefield.

Climbing on the ceiling in indoor or on the trees in outdoor, use an illusory object as a wall or other to hide behind to cast other spells after.

Perhaps oriented sand and water.

2/If you have advice about the spells, I am obviously interested to read them.
1 : grease, illusory object, verdant sprout, scouring sand
2 : entangle, fungal hypae, hideous laughter, sudden blight, rime slick
3 : aqueous orb, mad monkeys, wall of thorns, wall of wind, shifting sand, safe passage
4 : ice storm
5 : transmute rock and mud, strange geometry, pillars of sand, wall of ice
6 : repulsion
7 : volcanic eruption, unfettered pack, control sand, reverse gravity
8 : punishing winds, earthquake,

3/Does Synergistic Spell permit to cast 2 walls of ice in 2 hemisphere to obtain a sphere for example ?

4/does Tempest-Sun Redirection feat permit automatically that the allies protected from the damage of a spell that my character casted. Volcanic eruption ?

5/ Are Conceal spell and silent spell metamagic feats useful ? Current spell ?

Thanks for your future answer.

[Guntermench]

Doesn't look like you need spellcasting.

Keep in mind you can't cast spells with the concentrate trait (anything with a verbal component) while raging unless you take Moment of Clarity and use that first. This makes a spellcasting barbarian doable, but action inefficient.

Spells can be whatever you want, to varying degrees of success. Buffs are the most reliable as they don't need your spellcasting mod.

You can cast whatever second spell you want, provided you have the spell slot for it.

Tempest-Sun Redirection you pick who gets reduced damage. If you want it to be all your allies and a nearby goat, go nuts.

Metamagic is less useful for this build in general because you can't use it in combat if you are raging. I'm a big fan of Conceal Spell and Silent Spell though.

[Malk_Content]

I'll just want to note that while you can describe yourself as a Cliffscale Lizardfolk Undine, mechanically you can't be one. So if your build is using anything from the Cliffscale heritage, (i.e all the good climbing stuff) it doesn't work.

[HammerJack]

0: You'll need to talk to your GM about being able to use Imperial dragon with barbarian's dragon instinct. It isn't an option by default.

1: Magaambayan attendant does not require you to be a spellcaster. You have the lore requirements and the skill training requirements. The first part is story, and you need to talk to your GM. The second part is just skill training, and you don't need any kind of archetype for that. Magaambayan Attendant Dedication is required before taking Halcyon Speaker Dedication

2. While I could point at individual spells like Hideous Laughter and say "That is a good spell" it's hard to talk about this list overall, because I'm very confused about how this character intends to work. Why are they a barbarian if they are this focused on spellcasting, when so much of barbarian's ability is tied up in Rage, which would leave you unable to acst most spells without using Moment of Clarity?
path

4. You can use your reaction to use Tempest Sun Shielding to protect an ally from some of the damage that your own spell causes. It is not automatic, but does require your reaction and your spell slot expenditure. It does not protect multiple allies.

5. Having Conceal Spell and silent spell is basically the only way to be able to cast spells stealthily without giving away your position. Whether that's useful depends on whether you'll use that. Not a huge fan of current spell, myself.

[Castilliano]

Offensive spells may work if you're a spellcaster who pretends to be a Barbarian, but an actual Barbarian won't work that well, at least not as well as you seem to be thinking given the weight of your questions is on spells. Most PF2 battlefield control spells are "offensive" in the sense that you need a decent spell DC for them to work. Not that there won't be opportunistic moments where your spell is the perfect one, even if cast poorly.

Trouble with this image of a PC is that it takes a long time to build up spell slots through Dedications, after which you'll be behind the curve. Your highest spell level, proficiency, and casting stat will make you notably less effective once you do get a decent supply of slots (or Focus Spells, which might be the best route as they give a LOT more castings/day).

And of course most spells can't be cast while Raging, including I believe all the ones you've listed. So it'll be hard to call on the timely spell mid-battle.

Judging from your other forum questions, I think maybe you might be biting off more than one PC can chew. It's doable to have a Barbarian that begins combat with a spell before Raging and entering melee, but one's expectations on the effectiveness of that spell need to be tuned. You'll be about 1/3 of a normal caster's value re: spellcasting. Spells which do not rely on spell DC or Counteracting would be best.

I too wanted to build a Barbarian caster, but ultimately he ended up looking better as a savage Druid who looks barbaric. I still may make a Barbarian version, but the casting will be fluff to make him look cool with maybe an opportunistic moment here or there.

[Waldham]

Quote:

I'll just want to note that while you can describe yourself as a Cliffscale Lizardfolk Undine, mechanically you can't be one. So if your build is using anything from the Cliffscale heritage, (i.e all the good climbing stuff) it doesn't work.

Ah ok, it's not possible to take cliffscale heritage if I take versatile heritage undine, is it right ?

The versatile heritage replace the heritage from base ancestry, is it right ?

[HammerJack]

Correct. You still only get 1 heritage total. Versatile heritages can just be taken on all kinds of different ancestries.

[breithauptclan]

Barbarian + spellcasting is certainly problematic. But I don't think it is as problematic as it appears at first glance.

* There are spells that don't require actions with the Concentration trait.
* Moment of Clarity does exist, even though it is action intensive to use it regularly.
* The spellcasting Barbarian can decide to fight without Rage in order to keep casting spells with their normal action cost available.

This is actually a bit better than a Wild order Druid. The Druid also has to choose between casting spells or transforming into an animal battle form. But the Druid in animal form can't cast any spells no matter what actions the spell does or doesn't require and no matter how many actions the Druid wants to spend on casting them.