Voluntary Flaws Clarification Needed

[Beriliand]

I was trying to make a kobold fighter based on the one portrayed on "Little Trouble in Big Absalom" and I came across some problems with his abilities.

Simeek has STR 18, DEX 12, CON 14, INT 10, WIS 12, CHA 12

Selecting his options I came across this:
Ancestry: Kobold +2 DEX, +2 CHA, -2 CON, free (+2 STR)
Background: Laborer boosts STR or CON, free - I think they took +2 STR, +2 CON
Class: Fighter +2 STR

At this point he has 16 STR, 12 DEX, 10 CON, 10 INT, 10 WIS, 12 CHA.

I can't think of a way to apply 4 ability boosts and get the same abilities unless I apply two ability boost to CON as described on page 27 of core rulebook "Voluntary Flaws"

Quote:

Sometimes, it’s fun to play a character with a major flaw even if you’re not playing an ancestry that imposes one. You can elect to take two additional ability flaws when applying the ability boosts and ability flaws from your ancestry. If you do, you can also apply one additional free ability boost. These ability flaws can be assigned to any ability score you like, but you can’t apply more than one ability flaw to the same ability score during this step unless you apply both of the additional ability flaws to a score that is already receiving an ability boost during this step. In this case, the first ability flaw cancels the ability boost, and the second ability flaw decreases the score by 2. Likewise, as an exception to the normal rules for ability boosts, you can apply two free ability boosts to an ability score receiving an ability flaw during this step; the first ability boost cancels the ability flaw, and the second ability boost increases the score by 2. For example, a dwarf normally gets an ability boost to Constitution and Wisdom, along with an ability flaw to Charisma. You could apply one ability flaw each to Intelligence and Strength, or you could apply both ability flaws to Wisdom. You could not apply either additional ability flaw to Charisma, though, because it is already receiving dwarves’ ability flaw during this step.

But it seems it is not legal for play according to the character creation section for organised play:

Quote:

Pathfinder Society uses the standard method detailed under “Ability Score Overview” on page 20 of the Core Rulebook. Your character can also take two additional ability flaws to gain one additional ability boost as described in the Voluntary Flaws sidebar on page 26 of the Core Rulebook.

I may have missed something but I think they used a rule not explicitly mentioned on the rules. Is it legal for use since they used it on a santionable adventure or is it possible using 2 ability flaws for an ability boost?

My calculation with the voluntary flaws rule is STR 18, DEX 12, CON 14, INT 10, WIS 12, CHAR 10

Thanks in advance

[Nefreet]

Voluntary Flaws are allowed in Society, as you quoted.

Trying to do the math now, I believe Simeek was simply statted incorrectly.

Coincidentally, I did just GM a game for a player who thought it was one flaw for one boost, and not two-for-one, so perhaps the author fell into the same misunderstanding.

EDIT: According to the product discussion thread, there are apparently several errors with the Pregens. Isn't the first time that's happened; probably won't be the last.

[Ascalaphus]

There is no guarantee that pregens are built to comply with normal character building rules. Sometimes that's an error, and sometimes it's a deliberate choice. For example, the kobold pregens have some odd but cute weapons. The main pregens may go a bit over budget with gear (but don't get school items). And so on.

Bottom line is, you can't use them to say "the rule is this, look, the pregen does it".

[Tempest_Knight]

Paizo has a long standing history of the Pregens are Special and don't need to follow the rules...

PF1 examples...
Yoon is just a Small size Human... Amiri has two Combat traits... there are others...

This has led to issues in the past, and will probably continue to in the future, but the Kobold pregens in this case are only usable for 1 module, so not a big issue.

[Online Guide Team Lead - JTT]

Beriliand wrote:

I can't think of a way to apply 4 ability boosts and get the same abilities unless I apply two ability boost to CON as described on page 27 of core rulebook "Voluntary Flaws"

Quote:

Sometimes, it’s fun to play a character with a major flaw even if you’re not playing an ancestry that imposes one. You can elect to take two additional ability flaws when applying the ability boosts and ability flaws from your ancestry. If you do, you can also apply one additional free ability boost. These ability flaws can be assigned to any ability score you like, but you can’t apply more than one ability flaw to the same ability score during this step unless you apply both of the additional ability flaws to a score that is already receiving an ability boost during this step. In this case, the first ability flaw cancels the ability boost, and the second ability flaw decreases the score by 2. Likewise, as an exception to the normal rules for ability boosts, you can apply two free ability boosts to an ability score receiving an ability flaw during this step; the first ability boost cancels the ability flaw, and the second ability boost increases the score by 2. For example, a dwarf normally gets an ability boost to Constitution and Wisdom, along with an ability flaw to Charisma. You could apply one ability flaw each to Intelligence and Strength, or you could apply both ability flaws to Wisdom. You could not apply either additional ability flaw to Charisma, though, because it is already receiving dwarves’ ability flaw during this

But it seems it is not legal for play according to the character creation section for organised play:

Quote:

Pathfinder Society uses the standard method detailed under “Ability Score Overview” on page 20 of the Core Rulebook. Your character can also take two additional ability flaws to gain one additional ability boost as described in the Voluntary Flaws sidebar on page 26 of the Core Rulebook.

I may have missed something but I think they used a rule not explicitly mentioned on the rules. Is it legal for use since they used it on a santionable adventure or is it possible using 2 ability flaws for an ability boost?

At the time the guide was written, the Voluntary Flaw sidebar you listed, was on page 26. If it is now on page 27, I will need to update the guide.

Yes, that rule is indeed permitted in PFS.

[Jared Thaler - Personal Opinion]

Nefreet wrote:

Voluntary Flaws are allowed in Society, as you quoted.

Trying to do the math now, I believe Simeek was simply statted incorrectly.

Trying to do the math mentally just now, I made almost exactly the same math error they probably made.

"Okay, he has STR 18, so they clearly put one of each bonus into strength, lets look at the rest of it. ...(mental math)... Okay, and that gets us to the 4 free boosts. Let's put one each into Dex, Con, Int, and Wisdom.

Yup, that math looks right. Oh wait..."