Using bluff to make a diversion to hide

[DonLouigi]

Ahoy,

I've come across a part of the stealth rules in Pathfinder:

Quote:

Creating a Diversion to Hide: You can use Bluff to allow you to use Stealth. A successful Bluff check can give you the momentary diversion you need to attempt a Stealth check while people are aware of you.

However I could not find a reference to this anywhere so I ask myself: How does this work? What kind of action is the bluff check? What is the DC (does the recipient roll Sense Motive, as usual for bluff)? What kind of conditions and/or modifications apply to the corresponding Stealth-Check?

Does anyone have further information or experience on how to handle this?

All the best.

[Fuzzy-Wuzzy]

DonLouigi wrote:

Ahoy,

I've come across a part of the stealth rules in Pathfinder:

Quote:

Creating a Diversion to Hide: You can use Bluff to allow you to use Stealth. A successful Bluff check can give you the momentary diversion you need to attempt a Stealth check while people are aware of you.

However I could not find a reference to this anywhere so I ask myself: How does this work? What kind of action is the bluff check? What is the DC (does the recipient roll Sense Motive, as usual for bluff)? What kind of conditions and/or modifications apply to the corresponding Stealth-Check?

Does anyone have further information or experience on how to handle this?

All the best.

Bluff is always an opposed roll vs Sense Motive. Other than that... AFAICT people have been asking this since the playtest days and it has never been answered, at least for Pathfinder. However,

3.5 ed D&D wrote:

Creating a Diversion to Hide

You can use the Bluff skill to help you hide. A successful Bluff check gives you the momentary diversion you need to attempt a Hide check while people are aware of you. This usage does not provoke an attack of opportunity.

[...]

Action

Varies. A Bluff check made as part of general interaction always takes at least 1 round (and is at least a full-round action), but it can take much longer if you try something elaborate. A Bluff check made to feint in combat or create a diversion to hide is a standard action. A Bluff check made to deliver a secret message doesn’t take an action; it is part of normal communication.

I would go with that.

[Claxon]

It may not be stated clearly, but I agree that it's a standard action to perform.

Many people ignore this and allow you to hide anyways, but it's much like a person walking behind a tree where you can't see them and saying they're hidden. Sure you can't see them, but you know where they are, so they aren't really hidden from you.

[William Werminster]

Agreed to that. A standard action for Bluff vs Sense Motive, and if it's successful then a couple of options are possible, each of them made with their respective Stealth vs Perception check.

Find and hide behind cover, go to a dark place, flee the crime scene (*)... always remembering that you only have a move action left and of course modifiers and penalties may occur (i.e. the lie was awful, it's raining heavily, you are moving more than half your speed, etc).

At least that's the way we do it in our table.

(*) Things like that are no stated on the rules but if there's enough people to grant "cover" then this should be allowed in my opinion.

Hope it helped.

[DonLouigi]

Alright,l as it seems pathfinder does not have explicit rules, I agree, my reccomendation to our GM will be a standard action, opposed by the target's Sense Motive.

Quote:

Bluff is always an opposed roll vs Sense Motive.

Well, the "Feint" action ist Bluff vs Passive Sense Motive (10+target's sense motive modifier). But I agree, should probably be actively opposed.

However, concerning the Stealth Check, I did find something else:

d20pfsrd wrote:

If your observers are momentarily distracted (such as by a Bluff check), you can attempt to use Stealth. While the others turn their attention from you, you can attempt a Stealth check if you can get to an unobserved place of some kind. This check, however, is made at a –10 penalty because you have to move fast.

So, if you use the distraction you take -10? That seems excessive on top of the action cost. On the other hand it basically allows you to hide in plain sight, so maybe it is justified?