making small creature smaller


Rules Questions


is there a way to make a small creature tiny or deminitive size perminently? and can tiny or diminitive creatures threaten 5 feet away with a reach weapon?


Lady-J wrote:
is there a way to make a small creature tiny or deminitive size perminently? and can tiny or diminitive creatures threaten 5 feet away with a reach weapon?

Permanent reduce person would make a small creature tiny.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/reduce-person
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/permanency
A tiny creature with a reach weapon would threaten adjacent squares.

Permanency can be dispelled, so there is a risk to this approach.


Gallant Armor wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
is there a way to make a small creature tiny or deminitive size perminently? and can tiny or diminitive creatures threaten 5 feet away with a reach weapon?

Permanent reduce person would make a small creature tiny.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/reduce-person
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/permanency
A tiny creature with a reach weapon would threaten adjacent squares.

Permanency can be dispelled, so there is a risk to this approach.

ya not to much of a fan of permanency as its not really that permanent


Lady-J wrote:
Gallant Armor wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
is there a way to make a small creature tiny or deminitive size perminently? and can tiny or diminitive creatures threaten 5 feet away with a reach weapon?

Permanent reduce person would make a small creature tiny.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/reduce-person
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/permanency
A tiny creature with a reach weapon would threaten adjacent squares.

Permanency can be dispelled, so there is a risk to this approach.

ya not to much of a fan of permanency as its not really that permanent

If you GM allows for custom magic items, an item of continuous Reduce Person would cost 4000 GP if made into a slotted item, 6000GP if stacked with an existing slotted item and 8000 GP if slotless. If you have a crafter in the party, these costs would be halved. There is a lot of contention as to the value of some of the items created with the item creation formulas, so it's up to GM to decide how to price it. I don't know of an existing continuous reduce person item, but there may be others who can help you find one.


Lady-J wrote:
and can tiny or diminitive creatures threaten 5 feet away with a reach weapon?

Strict RAW, no. RAI, a Tiny creature does; this has been discussed by some staffer on the boards---basically, their natural reach is actually 2.5', which rounds down to 0 normally, but a reach weapon doubles it to 5'. Diminutive and Fine have even less natural reach, so even doubled they don't get to 5'.


Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
and can tiny or diminitive creatures threaten 5 feet away with a reach weapon?
Strict RAW, no. RAI, a Tiny creature does; this has been discussed by some staffer on the boards---basically, their natural reach is actually 2.5', which rounds down to 0 normally, but a reach weapon doubles it to 5'. Diminutive and Fine have even less natural reach, so even doubled they don't get to 5'.

I believe that if a Diminutive creature had a reach weapon, AND the Lunge feat, AND was under the effects of a Longarm spell, AND had a forth reach-enhancing element, like the Bloodrager's 4th level Aberrant Bloodline power, it would achieve an effective 5' reach.


Diminutive creatures have a space of 1 ft, so if their reach equals their space, they would indeed need 4 reach increases to get to 5 ft (Fine creatures would need 9, since their space is 1 ft).

I think you'd be better off resizing the grid if combats regularly involve Tiny or smaller creatures on multiple sides. A grid sized for Fine creatures would have squares 1/2 ft a side (so a Medium creature would take up 5x5 squares and have a reach of 5 squares).

Shadow Lodge

All you need to threaten is Longarm. It doesn't say to extend a reach category - it says add 5'. So you can be 1" tall and still hit people 5' away.

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