Quicken + Empower Spell-like ability

[Stephen Ede]

Looking at the Empower Spell-like Ability and Quciken Spell-like ability it appears to me that you can use both of them on the same spell-like ability with no limits beyond using them individually.

So at CL 12 you can Empower Quicken a 2nd lev Spell-like ability.

Have I got that right?

Empower -

Spoiler:

Empower Spell-Like Ability (Monster)
One of this creature's spell-like abilities is particularly potent and powerful.

Prerequisite: Spell-like ability at caster level 6th or higher.

Benefit: Choose one of the creature's spell-like abilities, subject to the restrictions below. The creature can use that ability as an empowered spell-like ability three times per day (or less, if the ability is normally usable only once or twice per day).

When a creature uses an empowered spell-like ability, all variable, numeric effects of the spell-like ability are increased by half (+50%). Saving throws and opposed rolls are not affected. Spell-like abilities without random variables are not affected.

The creature can only select a spell-like ability duplicating a spell with a level less than or equal to 1/2 its caster level (round down) – 2. For a summary, see Table: Empowered Spell-Like Abilities.

Special: This feat can be taken multiple times. Each time it is taken, the creature can apply it to a different spell-like ability.

Table: Empowered Spell-Like Abilities

Spell Level Caster Level to Empower
0 4th
1st 6th
2nd 8th
3rd 10th
4th 12th
5th 14th
6th 16th
7th 18th
8th 20th
9th —

Quicken -

Spoiler:

Quicken Spell-Like Ability (Monster)
This creature can use one of its spell-like abilities with next to no effort.

Prerequisite: Spell-like ability at CL 10th or higher.

Benefit: Choose one of the creature's spell-like abilities, subject to the restrictions described in this feat. The creature can use the chosen spell-like ability as a quickened spell-like ability three times per day (or less, if the ability is normally usable only once or twice per day).

Using a quickened spell-like ability is a swift action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity. The creature can perform another action—including the use of another spell-like ability (but not another swift action)—in the same round that it uses a quickened spell-like ability. The creature may use only one quickened spell-like ability per round.

The creature can only select a spell-like ability duplicating a spell with a level less than or equal to 1/2 its caster level (round down) – 4. For a summary, see Table: Quickened Spell-Like Abilities.

A spell-like ability that duplicates a spell with a casting time greater than 1 full round cannot be quickened.

Spell Level Caster Level to Quicken
0 8th
1st 10th
2nd 12th
3rd 14th
4th 16th
5th 18th
6th 20th
7th —
8th —
9th —
Normal: The use of a spell-like ability normally requires a standard action (at the very least) and provokes an attack of opportunity.

Special: This feat can be taken multiple times. Each time it is taken, the creature can apply it to a different one of its spell-like abilities.

Thanks

[DM Papa.DRB]

No.

A 2nd level spell that is empowered is +2 levels so it is considered a 4th level spell.

A 2nd level empowered spell that is quickened is +4 levels so it is an 8th level spell.

Therefor you would have to be able to naturally cast 8th level spells (15th or 16th level depending on class).

-- david

[Stephen Ede]

Spell-Like abilities aren't spells.

And, with the exception of Heighten Spell, Metamagic doesn't increase the level of spells. It only increases the spell slot needed to cast it.

Spell-like abilities don't use spell slots.

[DM Papa.DRB]

Oops, sorry, I read spells not spell-like ability. Time for new glasses.

[Kayerloth]

I'm thinking that no you wouldn't be able to but not sure if it works out RAW that way.

I'd say that RAI anyway (and probably what I'd do) is select a spell-like ability duplicating a spell with a level less than or equal to 1/2 its caster level (round down) – 6 (the combined effect of -2 and -4, as that is where the +2 and +4 level mods pop up for the metamagic effects).

Or you would need to be level 16 ... [1/2*(16)]-6=2

Which not unsurprisingly is about the caster level needed to actually cast a Quickened, Empowered 2nd level spell. A wizard of 12th level is actually only capable of using Quickened Empowered 0-level spells.

[midgardinruin]

Stephen Ede wrote:

... beyond using them individually.

Could you expand on what you mean by 'using them individually'?

Stephen Ede wrote:

So at CL 12 you can Empower Quicken a 2nd lev Spell-like ability.

Yes. Given a caster level of 12 and both feats were selected to apply to the same spell-like ability, nothing prevents you from applying both empower spell-like ability and quicken spell-like ability to a given use of the specified SLA.

[Stephen Ede]

midgardinruin wrote:

Stephen Ede wrote:

... beyond using them individually.

Could you expand on what you mean by 'using them individually'?

I mrant that unlike Metamagic on a spell, where you add the costs of multiple metamagics applied to a spell together, as far as I could see with Spell-like abilities you individually check each metamagic feat to make the Casting lev check.

So know matter how many Metamagic feats you apply to a Spell like ability each feat is treated as if it's the only one been applied.