|
1 person marked this as a favorite.
|
Sorry if this has been asked before (almost positive at least part of it has not but I apologize if it has) but I have a 2 part request for advice:
1: my DM has recently given me the green light to pursue my quest for lichdom! However my character is more of the blend in type than the stand out type and is looking for ways to hide his lichyness to all extents possible. It has been house ruled that my character may pick up the Life-Dominant Soul feat to at least partially hide from detection from channeled positive energy used for healing, but I could certainly use some more help for "blending in" even if it comes at the expense of the bonuses that come from being a lich.
2: I've heard that demi-planes are the best place to keep a phylactory safe, is there a way to further protect it within a plane such as limiting who can enter it or hiding the plane among another plane/etc?
thank you everyone for your help and sorry if this has been asked already.
|
3 people marked this as a favorite.
|
1. Blending in is going to be hard, since most creatures that look at you are going to run away in fear or at least be shaken. Whether you can suppress that or whether that's based on your appearance (hat of disguise for instance) might be negotiable.
2. Other planes are great because a lot of divinations and such have trouble crossing planar boundaries. Created demi-planes are also good because you can typically restrict who can and cannot get into one.
I don't personally like the idea of trying to make a phylactery impossible to get to (I've never been a lich though). I tend to think such things are a bit cheesy, though to each their own. I prefer good old misdirection. First, you could leave a 'copy' of your notes somewhere, where it describes your plan to build the phylactery (the basic tiny box that holds your soul) but that's just what everyone expects. You've really made your phylactery into a ring or an amulet and further enchanted into a really decent item that they aren't likely to just trade out (you're a lich, if you can't handle making an item like that while doing your phylactery then you aren't ready). Maybe you've already given it to PCs (how often do they ever actually permanently lose magic items?). Possibly you've done it through an agent who had them go on some quest, either for the purpose of of believably handing the item off to them, or because you actually wanted them to gather you something for your own goals and research.
Now they've got what they think is a +3 ring of protection and featherfall which is also your phylactery and doesn't even detect as evil (likely unless you're killed and your soul's in it) and they're all looking for a box because that's what your notes say. Of course, you've also made a magic box that looks just like a stereotypical evil phylactery and you've even got a magic mouth set inside (it's lead-lined as well as unopenable) that's set to just scream out "NOoooooo!" if the box is destroyed.
Presumably if you die, your body will start forming near the ring. If the ring moves about, distance really shouldn't be a problem. (though probably moving to another plane might restart the process) and you appear likely near the people who killed you (maybe because you were just wearing the ring yourself for the additional power and they looted it.) or you appear in town where they sold the ring and you get it back, along with your other belongings they sold off.
Best bet, make the PCs care about the item and never know it's your phylactery. You might have trouble making your phylactery into good or holy item or weapon (or maybe you won't if you aren't evil until after becoming a lich) but what PC is going to destroy a +3 holy undead-bane bastard sword. It will probably have to have some incredibly valuable jewel or other spot for your soul to reside while a new body is being made, but gem-inlaid pommels and such are not unheard of. Bonus points if you can make it an intelligent weapon with a special purpose of slaying liches (and additional powers when trying to do so, other than finding them obviously.) The weapon doesn't know it's secretly your phylactery, all it knows is that it loves sending PCs to try and kill you, and whether they succeed or not you always come back.
I don't really have a lot to add but... Pizza Lord wrote: Best bet, make the PCs care about the item and never know it's your phylactery. You might have trouble making your phylactery into good or holy item or weapon (or maybe you won't if you aren't evil until after becoming a lich) but what PC is going to destroy a +3 holy undead-bane bastard sword. It will probably have to have some incredibly valuable jewel or other spot for your soul to reside while a new body is being made, but gem-inlaid pommels and such are not unheard of. Bonus points if you can make it an intelligent weapon with a special purpose of slaying liches (and additional powers when trying to do so, other than finding them obviously.) The weapon doesn't know it's secretly your phylactery, all it knows is that it loves sending PCs to try and kill you, and whether they succeed or not you always come back. I am so stealing this idea.
I believe there is a new kind of lich coming in Horror Adventures whose phylactery is its family line
This opens up so many possibilities :-))
dragonhunterq wrote: I don't really have a lot to add but...Pizza Lord wrote: Best bet, make the PCs care about the item and never know it's your phylactery. You might have trouble making your phylactery into good or holy item or weapon (or maybe you won't if you aren't evil until after becoming a lich) but what PC is going to destroy a +3 holy undead-bane bastard sword. It will probably have to have some incredibly valuable jewel or other spot for your soul to reside while a new body is being made, but gem-inlaid pommels and such are not unheard of. Bonus points if you can make it an intelligent weapon with a special purpose of slaying liches (and additional powers when trying to do so, other than finding them obviously.) The weapon doesn't know it's secretly your phylactery, all it knows is that it loves sending PCs to try and kill you, and whether they succeed or not you always come back. I am so stealing this idea. +1
Actually, make your phylactery the jewel-encrusted scabbard of the sword. :)
Phylactery pings as evil though, doesn't it? And who would want to regenerate right next to the PCs, naked, and without most of your spells available? That seems like a poor choice...
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
I don't believe there are any rules saying that a phylactery pings as evil.
Pizza Lord wrote: 1. Blending in is going to be hard, since most creatures that look at you are going to run away in fear or at least be shaken. Whether you can suppress that or whether that's based on your appearance (hat of disguise for instance) might be negotiable.
2. Other planes are great because a lot of divinations and such have trouble crossing planar boundaries. Created demi-planes are also good because you can typically restrict who can and cannot get into one.
I don't personally like the idea of trying to make a phylactery impossible to get to (I've never been a lich though). I tend to think such things are a bit cheesy, though to each their own. I prefer good old misdirection. First, you could leave a 'copy' of your notes somewhere, where it describes your plan to build the phylactery (the basic tiny box that holds your soul) but that's just what everyone expects. You've really made your phylactery into a ring or an amulet and further enchanted into a really decent item that they aren't likely to just trade out (you're a lich, if you can't handle making an item like that while doing your phylactery then you aren't ready). Maybe you've already given it to PCs (how often do they ever actually permanently lose magic items?). Possibly you've done it through an agent who had them go on some quest, either for the purpose of of believably handing the item off to them, or because you actually wanted them to gather you something for your own goals and research.
Now they've got what they think is a +3 ring of protection and featherfall which is also your phylactery and doesn't even detect as evil (likely unless you're killed and your soul's in it) and they're all looking for a box because that's what your notes say. Of course, you've also made a magic box that looks just like a stereotypical evil phylactery and you've even got a magic mouth set inside (it's lead-lined as well as unopenable) that's set to just scream out "NOoooooo!" if the box is destroyed.
Presumably if you die,...
sorry for the delay in response. Good ideas! One of my concerns is that the party does have a paladin. yes I know by the book rules he would lose his class abilities for even being in the same party as me without constant atonement. GM is house ruling that as long as my true identity is unknown to him he wont suffer any ill effects since we have fudged the rules for paladins anyway and they can be any good or true lawful (plan B is obviously the litch thing to do about it...). Hat of disguise or the like will obviously be used, and paizo does say that litches can prevent rot by eating and drinking like a normal person). Good call about the fear aura, I forgot about that. It could possibly be chalked up to my wizard being known as not very approachable by the huddled masses and a little infamous for his cruelty towards his enemies, but I should find a way where I could turn it off.
I do admit half of my concern about my phylactory is paladin based. I dont think the GM would create an NPC party to go hunting for it. The other half is just flavor based for my character, since he obviously would want his phylactory to be as protected as possible. I do like the idea of making it too valuable for someone to want to destroy it, but it would be nice if there was a way for it to inspire greed to a sinister level (like the golden poop from American Dad or the One Ring).
Boom - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/daywalker
(Sorry I don't know how to make it all fancy)
I suppose if he's fudging the rules for paladins then he could just fudge the rules for liches being automatically evil just and let them not be evil if they don't do evil things. That would probably work better for everyone.
Just make your phylactery into a phylactery of faithfulness and gift it to the paladin. It has a quirk that the only thing it doesn't warn against is interactions with you specifically. Technically interacting with you or even adventuring with you shouldn't be an issue, but this will help keep him from getting too suspicious as long as you play your part and don't make it obvious that you're a scumbag/monstrous-abomination-against-nature. It actually works in every other way; stealing, killing an innocent, ignoring someone in need, fleeing a battlefield before the rest of the party, etc.
Obviously this won't stop him from knowing you're an ill-suited party-member if you don't actually play the part and make the effort to hide your true nature, so that's good. It doesn't take away your responsibility as a role-player.
"Hmm, apparently there's no problem with me helping you dump this body in the river."
Then, just in case you do end up screwing him out of his powers, spend a little extra time and money and have it auto-cast atonement while he sleeps just in case. Presumably he'll legitimately be puzzled, troubled, and want to do the right thing, so that's a-okay, it's not like he's getting atonement when he really doesn't want it, he's honestly been duped or made a mistake..
You can slowly upgrade the item as you adventure to make sure he doesn't want to replace it and to prove you're a valued friend (adding hidden quirks as desired to protect yourself just in case it's a power or ability that might cause you trouble later.)
Well my character is already evil, but not scummy evil or kill the innocent evil. more of "ends justify the means"/he is incredoubly selfish/he's not above drowning an unconscious enemy evil. Paladin already knows that and we do have our moments of disagreement (mainly with continuing to drown unconcious enemies... seriously love aquaeous orb!) but my wizard is smart enough to let the paladin think that he will agree to what the paladin demands when it comes to lesser things, all the while working on this much grater thing (lich); and the paladin is kind of stuck working with me since my character is the last surviving original party member (thanks to some very bad rolls) and the only one with the knowledge of how to defeat the big bad we are working towards. So there wont be any change in alignment aura when I become a lich.
That is an awesome idea about the phylactery of faithfulness. Are there any items that can change one's aura from evil to good? Maybe I can convince the paladin that I have changed my ways and am offering a peace gift, and he will be none the wiser that I am a lord of the undead?
Goat God wrote: Boom - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/daywalker
(Sorry I don't know how to make it all fancy)
Made it fancy for you. :)
Boom
That Daywalker spell that's being mentioned seems like a perfect ticket, but if you can't get ahold of it, then nondectection and misdirection are good choices, and definitely core.
Nondetection will prevent anyone from getting a reading on you or even scrying on you unless they beat a Caster level check against 15 + your caster level (likely way more than the paladin will be able to do).
Misdirection is lower level and lasts just as long but lets you mimic the aura or reading of an object that's nearby when you cast the spell (you can later move away). It doesn't alert or give a save to to the target of the spell or the object being emulated, so you can even cast it on yourself with the paladin as your object and any detection spells on you will read as though you were the paladin (lawful good, not lying, etc) even if the paladin is doing it.
Misdirection is definitely more sneaky and fun, The downside is that it allows a Will saving throw when someone tries a detection, so there's a slightly better chance for the paladin to pass that or get a natural 20, whereas the caster level check for nondetection might be impossible for the paladin.
The Raven Black wrote: I believe there is a new kind of lich coming in Horror Adventures whose phylactery is its family line
This opens up so many possibilities :-))
Also known as the "Charles Dexter Ward" contingency. :)
Also, with regards to the phylactery: The best place to hide a needle is not in a haystack, but among a lot of other needles. Hide the phylactery in the tomb of a Saint or something, alongside a bunch of other trinkets and relics that aren't really valuable but maybe are part of a big pilgrimage site or something.
Does anyone in your party have Knowledge (Religion)? If so, by rules they'd get to roll to identify you so they might just recognize you by sight.
Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Xandloft wrote: Sorry if this has been asked before (almost positive at least part of it has not but I apologize if it has) but I have a 2 part request for advice:
1: my DM has recently given me the green light to pursue my quest for lichdom! However my character is more of the blend in type than the stand out type and is looking for ways to hide his lichyness to all extents possible. It has been house ruled that my character may pick up the Life-Dominant Soul feat to at least partially hide from detection from channeled positive energy used for healing, but I could certainly use some more help for "blending in" even if it comes at the expense of the bonuses that come from being a lich.
2: I've heard that demi-planes are the best place to keep a phylactory safe, is there a way to further protect it within a plane such as limiting who can enter it or hiding the plane among another plane/etc?
thank you everyone for your help and sorry if this has been asked already.
1. A hat of disguise to hide your appearance or regular use of gentle repose to prevent your body from decaying can both work.
2. Use stone shape to make a room 600 ft inside a hill (or under your home) to store your phylactery, a spare set of spellbooks, a replacement body (treated with unguent of timelessness or wearing a custom-made continuous effect gentle repose item), and possibly some spare magic items (such as a scroll of dimension door and a small bag of holding); then cast mage's private sanctum and permanency before using stone shape to fully fill in the entry passage (and all other openings). Each time you are "killed," you just need to get another replacement body after fully recovering (using dimension door to enter and exit; you can carry a corpse in the bag of holding).
MageHunter wrote: Goat God wrote: Boom - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/daywalker
(Sorry I don't know how to make it all fancy)
Made it fancy for you. :)
Boom you good sir have boomed my dynamite!
2. Use stone shape to make a room 600 ft inside a hill (or under your home) to store your phylactery, a spare set of spellbooks, a replacement body (treated with unguent of timelessness or wearing a custom-made continuous effect gentle repose item), and possibly some spare magic items (such as a scroll of dimension door and a small bag of holding); then cast mage's private sanctum and permanency before using stone shape to fully fill in the entry passage (and all other openings). Each time you are "killed," you just need to get another replacement body after fully recovering (using dimension door to enter and exit; you can carry a corpse in the bag of holding). this is brilliant!
Wolfsnap wrote: The Raven Black wrote: I believe there is a new kind of lich coming in Horror Adventures whose phylactery is its family line
This opens up so many possibilities :-))
Also known as the "Charles Dexter Ward" contingency. :)
Also, with regards to the phylactery: The best place to hide a needle is not in a haystack, but among a lot of other needles. Hide the phylactery in the tomb of a Saint or something, alongside a bunch of other trinkets and relics that aren't really valuable but maybe are part of a big pilgrimage site or something. I had a dracolich in my game that did this - he had literally hundreds of Magic Aura spells cast on various objects around him to make the adventurers have trouble finding his actual phylactery.
A lich's phylactery will recreate a body, so you don't need corpses laying around. I don't see any mechanic that 'normally' allows a lich's soul in a phylactery to inhabit a waiting corpse.
Dracolichs on the other hand, do gain the ability to possess reptilian corpses near their phylacteries, so it does make sense for them to have some reptilian bodies near their phylacteries. So that's a difference between them.
|
