Hello, I'm not sure where else to post this so I'll post this here, feel free to move it if it doesn't fit. We're playing a gestalt Kingmaker campaign with third party & 3.5 rules, & he's looking to do rogue 19 & swordsage 1 on one side of the gestalt. He's following this guide on reddit, and is gestalting fighter or brawler on the other side.
Basically my question is if he can take Assassins Stance, which is a third level stance, after taking only one level of swordsage. I know that rogue levels count for half for initiator levels for maneuvers, but I don't know about stances. Can he choose a third level stance with only one level of swordsage if he has at least eight rogue levels or does he need more swordsage levels?
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Go two Swordsage levels for Wisdom to AC in light armor.
Next, every 2 levels of a non-initiator class counts as 1 level of an initiator class for determining your initiator level. Up through level 3,he is initiator level 1. 4-5 is initiator level 2. 6-7 is initiator level 3, and he can pick any 2nd level maneuvers his class gives access to. Level 8 is initiator 4, and at level 9 he can pick up any 3rd level maneuvers he meets the prerequisites for. Some maneuvers and stances will require at least 1 or 2 maneuvers from a specific discipline before you can take them.
Page 39, top right.
And since you have enough levels to qualify for 3rd level maneuvers, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to take them, as long as you can fill prerequisites.
2d6 extra sneak attack isn't great though. I think Island of Blades would be a lot better. Pearl of Black Doubt is pretty good as well, if you have a good way to gain concealment, you could have some impressive AC for a round. Of course, you could always take Martial Study / Martial Stance and get all these anyway without a level dip if you want a couple more levels (level 11).
Nice, thanks for the advice Calethos! Just to clarify, are you saying then that stances=maneuvers, & that one level in swordsage is fine for him to take a third level stance?
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Stances are considered maneuvers unless something specifically specifies "stance". You cannot select stances with your maneuver slots. However, 1st level Swordsage gives you any stance you qualify for.
Awesome, thanks!
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I don't have my books handy, but I'm pretty sure that the description for the 1st level Swordsage (as do the Warblade and Crusader) indicates that the stance gained is a 1st lvl stance.
Either that or it was in one of the FAQs/errata for the Book of Nine Swords.
There were a lot of optimization builds using the classes, but one of the key factors was having to dip extra levels into them to get higher level stances.
The maneuvers slots can be filled with which ever level, so long as you meet the requirements.
[edited for spelling]
So my initial suspicions were right then? Or can you choose a third level stance with one level of swordsage? The character in question is trying to get Assassin's Stance to qualify for the epic feat Improved Sneak Attack a few levels earlier
Eh, he's right. You gain a first level stance. You can, however, take that single level of Swordsage and then take the Martial Stance feat to gain a stance you qualify for.
Also, Epic feats have the prerequisite of being an epic level character (21+), despite what it says in the feat description. Getting Improved Sneak Attack early won't be possible. You'll need to get to level 21 first.