Problem with oracle stone mystery

[nussbeep]

the spell list for the stone mystery does not appear to be well thought out. It looks, in fact, like it was imported from elsewhere in the rule set without consideration of the revelations available to the stone oracle. Consider the revelation rock throwing, which is so useful that it is very likely to be selected at 1st or 3rd level. It is entirely more powerful than the 2nd level spell gained - "magic stone". The spell should be replaced with something more different, such as "expeditious excavation". Similarly, many players are likely to select earth glide at 7th level, making the spell "meld with stone" pretty senseless at 8th level. It is only better in that it has a greater duration. Otherwise it is entirely inferior. A more reasonable spell might be stone shape or raging rubble or greater thunderstomp.

What do you think?

Eric Aka nussbeep

[Lincoln Hills]

I think that although rock throwing is nice, it is self-only, while magic stone can be used for allies with slings. And since you get revelations a lot less often than spells, I'd rather have meld with stone and save my revelation slot for something else. (Nice though earthglide is.)

I'm not saying the spell choices for that mystery are what I'd have picked myself, but I don't think the spells they chose were terrible (given the fairly limited selection of earth and stone-related spells at most levels.)

[Casual Viking]

You should absolutely house rule that. Do the same for the Earth clerics and the Shaman as well.

[jbadams]

Depending on the build a player has in mind they might be just as likely to select Acid Skin, Crystal Sight, Mighty Pebble, Shard Explosion, Stone Stability, or Touch of Acid at first or third level, and may put Rock Throwing off for quite some time. In this case Magic Stone would be more useful for a longer period of time. In addition, consider that Magic Stone can be used to enchant stones for other characters, whilst Rock Throwing helps only yourself.

Similarly, not all players are equally likely to choose Earth Glide at level 7; I would expect it to be reasonably popular, but it's certainly far from guaranteed. As you noted, Meld Into Stone provides a greater duration than Earth Glide. You are also not prohibited from entering worked stone as with Earth Glide, and the spell stipulates that you can hear what happens around you, which is not similarly specified for Earth Glide.

Sure, the spells aren't useful for every build, but I'm sure there are players who would consider your own suggested replacements to be similarly useless. Personally I don't see anything wrong with the spell list.

//EDIT: Well, looks like I was well and truly beaten to that one! Hopefully the extra detail makes up for it! :)

[The Archive]

Magic stone can be more useful against undead. It gets 2d6+2 against them instead of the usual 1d6+1. The spell also benefits from rock throwing's +1 racial bonus to throwing rocks. As well, you can use them with a sling boosting the range increment from 20 to 50 feet.

Meld with Stone and Earth Glide generally would serve different purposes. Earth Glide allows you to transverse solid stone. Meld with Stone merely lets you enter it, but has a greater duration. One is useful for passing through stone, the other is allows you to hide in stone for a much longer time. As well, you receive Meld with Stone at 6th level, not 8th.