Water Walk, Communal

[My Self]

Question: See if you can find anything weird with these spells:

Answer:

Spoiler:

It's the spell level. Why would anybody ever prepare normal Water Walk?

prd wrote:

WATER WALK

School transmutation [water]; Level cleric 3, ranger 3
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S, DF
Range touch
Targets one touched creature/level
Duration 10 min./level (D)
Saving Throw Will negates (harmless); Spell Resistance yes (harmless)
The transmuted creatures can tread on any liquid as if it were firm ground. Mud, oil, snow, quicksand, running water, ice, and even lava can be traversed easily, since the subjects' feet hover an inch or two above the surface. Creatures crossing molten lava still take damage from the heat because they are near it. The subjects can walk, run, charge, or otherwise move across the surface as if it were normal ground.

If the spell is cast underwater (or while the subjects are partially or wholly submerged in whatever liquid they are in), the subjects are borne toward the surface at 60 feet per round until they can stand on it.

prd wrote:

WATER WALK, COMMUNAL

Level cleric 2, ranger 2
Target creatures touched
This spell functions like water walk, except you divide the duration in 10-minute intervals among the creatures touched.

[Serghar Cromwell]

If for some reason you need to cast it on a lot of people for a long time, normal water walk is strictly better because it doesn't divide duration.

[Berinor]

You should have seen it before the errata. Communal was a 4th level spell.

But yes, Serghar is correct. The regular spell applies the full duration to 1 creature/level. Communal splits it up. So if you need it to last a while on more than one creature, it's way better than extend. Plus, the regular one is older.

[My Self]

So regular Water Walk, you touch a bunch of people and give them full duration, communal, you touch just as many people, and give them partial duration.

Anybody feel like the names should be reversed?

[Lost In Limbo]

Communal Water Walk was written after Water Walk, by someone who hadn't properly read the original spell.

I believe a dev commented on this situation at some point, but I'm running out of the house and don't have time to look it up right now.

[2bz2p]

Complete waste of a spell unless you take the communal version as an overall time value. So, an 8th level caster with normal WW can get 8 peeps for 80 mins. The CWW SHOULD be the total of that duration 640 Mins, allowing for the possibility of 64 people holding hands to gain water walk for 10 minutes - enough to save the village from the wildfire by crossing the big river.

[Taja the Barbarian]

2bz2p wrote:

Complete waste of a spell unless you take the communal version as an overall time value. So, an 8th level caster with normal WW can get 8 peeps for 80 mins. The CWW SHOULD be the total of that duration 640 Mins, allowing for the possibility of 64 people holding hands to gain water walk for 10 minutes - enough to save the village from the wildfire by crossing the big river.

The communal version is actually lower level (2nd vs. 3rd), so it is appropriately weaker (good for getting a small group across a river or for solo adventurer crossing a large lake, but not so good for a party trying to cross that same lake).

Generally speaking, the inclusion of 'communal' in the spell name is a good indicator you should just ignore it, but this version of Water Walk is fine due to the reduced spell level...

[Mysterious Stranger]

There is nothing to prevent a caster from casting communal water walk on a single target. The fact it is a lower level spell is going to make it easier to get the party across the lake. Sacrificing multiple lower level spells is preferable to sacrificing the same number of higher level spells. Now instead of needing to cast 4 3rd level spells the caster can cast 4 2nd level spells. How is this weaker?

[Taja the Barbarian]

Mysterious Stranger wrote:

There is nothing to prevent a caster from casting communal water walk on a single target. The fact it is a lower level spell is going to make it easier to get the party across the lake. Sacrificing multiple lower level spells is preferable to sacrificing the same number of higher level spells. Now instead of needing to cast 4 3rd level spells the caster can cast 4 2nd level spells. How is this weaker?

For a typical adventuring party (say 5 PCs), it's only one 3rd level spell for at least 50 minutes of walking, or five 2nd level spells for that same timeframe.

Now, if you are only need the buff for 10 minutes, the Communal version is great, but if you actually want the full duration (traveling through a swamp/marsh, adventuring in a sewer system, crossing a body of water of a large size, fighting in a partially flooded cave system, etc.), then you really want the non-communal version...