[Dreamscarred Press] Ironborn Redundancies


Advice and Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

I really like the idea of the Forgeborn but looking over Ultimate Psionics again I realized that the fighter archetype Ironborn has two abilities that are pretty useless.

1. Part of the armor aptitude ability states that an Ironborn can move at their normal speed in medium or heavy armor, but the Forgeborn racial ability slow and steady already does this.
2. Always armored allows you to sleep in armor without becoming fatigued, but half-constructs like the Forgeborn don't need to sleep at all.

In addition there seems to be virtually no downside to taking the Oreheart racial trait over the standard source crystal. Sure you only get half the benefit from fast healing but taking half damage from all negative energy effects and being healed by repair effects seems like a pretty damn good trade off.

I just wonder why they bothered to create this archetype when it's so redundant to the base race abilities, especially when the Forgeborn are such natural combatants. Perhaps there's been some errata since the Ultimate Psionics book was published but it would need to completely change the two abilities.


1) I haven't looked (the book isn't around) but can the racial be traded out? That would make it less than redundant.

2) Just because they are a fighter, doesn't mean they won't multiclass.

Half-construct wrote:
Half-constructs do not breathe, eat, or sleep, unless they want to gain some beneficial effect from one of these activities. This means that a half-construct can drink potions to benefit from their effects and can sleep in order to regain spells, but neither of these activities is required for the construct to survive or stay in good health.

If they multiclass into a caster, they still need to rest and so would have to strip down to not take penalty. If they wanted to sleep to gain back HP or ability damage, or take advantage of a spell that required sleep... There are numerous reasons to do so.

Grand Lodge

I checked at the time of the original post and there were no racial traits that can be trades for slow and steady.
I still feel like the second ability is pretty terrible, even if you were to multi-class to one that requires rest to regain spells why would you wear armor with an arcane spell failure chance? There are classes that this doesn't apply to but Forgeborn are generally not well suited to them. This one seems like it should already be a racial trait since it's so specific and weak.

Grand Lodge

I'm not sure if Forgeborn require rest or sleep to regain hp or ability damage, the line "but neither of these activities is required for the construct to survive or stay in good health." is rather ambiguous.


Jorda75 wrote:
I checked at the time of the original post and there were no racial traits that can be trades for slow and steady.
Psionics Augmented p. 8 wrote:
Quickened Steps: Although most forgeborn are steady in their gait, some are designed for speed. Forgeborn with this trait have a speed of 30 ft. This replaces slow and steady and fearless.
Jorda75 wrote:
I still feel like the second ability is pretty terrible, even if you were to multi-class to one that requires rest to regain spells why would you wear armor with an arcane spell failure chance? There are classes that this doesn't apply to but Forgeborn are generally not well suited to them. This one seems like it should already be a racial trait since it's so specific and weak.

Because you want to be a psion or a cleric that also have to rest to regain PP/spells?


What is dead may never die.


Gambit wrote:
What is dead may never die.

That is not dead which can eternal lie,

And with strange Aeons even death may die

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