WOtR Seelah - please clarify her skill

[dzone]

Seelah - When you attempt a check, Before for you act you may use your charisma skill instead of any listed skill.

Some people state that you can decide to use your charisma skill on a check, regardless of the kind as long as you decide before you role the dice.

Some please indicate it has to say before you act perform a xyz check, on the card, then you may substitute charisma - which is a much rarer occurrence.

Can we please get an official responce to this. It is not clear.

[Hooloovoo]

'Before you act' is a specific time in the sequence of Encountering a Card. The reference sheet on the back of the manual shows a summary of the full sequence. Only checks that are part of effects that happen 'Before you act' can be modified by Seelah's skill -- the much rarer occurences you referred to. It can still be quite handy though, so be sure not to forget about it if you are playing Seelah!

[dzone]

That what I thought, but that's poop. There is not much you can do before you act, evade is the only character activity. Everything else is a card required activity ie perform a knowledge check before you act to lower difficulty of combat check. I think a player will encounter this type of action a handful of times through out play --> poop

Paizo can you answer this officially in the FAQ section so that players are not arguing over this rule?

[Hawkmoon269]

Yeah, but Seelah can use her charisma instead of knowledge in that situation. Plus, you've only seen less than half the game.

For some confirmation, see this thread. Specifically, look for Keith's comment at the end.

[Andrew L Klein]

Is an FAQ necessary when it would just be a reiteration of something already in the rules?

[Frencois]

If Seelah could use her Charisma in any situation what's the point in having other skills? You could play with only one die, put all your skill feats on it. Collect only cards that boost charisma. Now you automatically win 80% of checks. So you can get rid of 80% of the cards that have no value anymore....
That would be so not fun...

[Hycisath]

I tend to run into these pretty often. the one that sticks out in my mind makes you succeed at an arcane or divine check or you can't use spells with the attack trait. I'm not even sure what card that's is, but I'm well aware of it when it comes up. I find Alain's skill to be worse than hers.

[Michael Klaus]

Punctuation!

dzone wrote:

When you attempt a check, Before for you act you may use your charisma skill instead of any listed skill.

Actually the card reads:

Seelah (WOTR) wrote:

When you attempt a check before for you act, you may use your Charisma skill instead of any listed skill.

"Let's eat grandpa." and "Let's eat, grandpa." do not mean the same thing.

Thinking back to ROTR and S&S there were so many Dex/Acrobatics checks for Ranged attacks or evasion effects or Con/Fortitude checks. I think a d10 for those rolls is pretty powerful. Basically Seelah can never be caught off guard by those nasty checks.

If it was for the player to chose on every single check than the power yould be phrased as: "For your checks you may use your Charisma skill instead of any listed skill." There would be no need to focus on the before you act step since whenever you have an option on what to roll, you have to decide before you roll unless a crad specifically states you can modify it afterwards.

But I got another question: Let's say Seelah attempts a check in the Before you act step and plays a spell like Aid on the check. Then she will attempt to recharge the spell which is technically still a check before she acts. And that is IMO why her power might need reconsideration: "When a bane makes you attempt a check before you act, you may use your..." Would keep her from using her Charisma on recharge or other triggered checks.

[Frencois]

Michael Klaus wrote:

... Let's say Seelah attempts a check in the Before you act step and plays a spell like Aid on the check. Then she will attempt to recharge the spell which is technically still a check before she acts. And that is IMO why her power might need reconsideration: "When a bane makes you attempt a check before you act, you may use your..." Would keep her from using her Charisma on recharge or other triggered checks.

Actually I'm not sure it's an issue. As you say, as long as you are within the "Before your act" step, Seelah as the opportunity to use her Charisma. Including - why not? - on recharge and the like checks that are triggered within the step. Seems intentional or at least not broken (whereas extending Seelah's power past that step would indeed be broken).

IMHO. But I'm not playing Seelah so who am I to argue :-)?

[Sandslice]

Michael Klaus wrote:

But I got another question: Let's say Seelah attempts a check in the Before you act step and plays a spell like Aid on the check. Then she will attempt to recharge the spell which is technically still a check before she acts. And that is IMO why her power might need reconsideration: "When a bane makes you attempt a check before you act, you may use your..." Would keep her from using her Charisma on recharge or other triggered checks.

Not necessary, because a general rule already handles it: recharging a spell is a separate step from casting it. In your example, you're casting Aid before you act; you recharge Aid in a situational step between "before you act" and "while you act."

Seelah's power doesn't apply during this cleanup step, only before you act.