At rank 10, is the reduction in the penalty to move at full speed meant to also cut the sniping penalty in half? The ability is worded very strangely:
Stealth Skill Unlock wrote: With sufficient ranks in Stealth, you earn the following.
5 Ranks: Reduce the Stealth penalty from sniping by 10.
10 Ranks: Stealth check penalties for moving quickly are
halved, including the ability unlocked at 5 ranks, moving full
speed, and reaching concealment after creating a distraction.
Does this mean that the penalty from sniping is a penalty from moving? Does that have any bearing on other abilities that negate penalties from moving?
Making a shot involves swift and violent motion. Other abilities (like the Fast Stealth talent) usually only help out specifically with the check to Stealth at full speed, but they tend to tell you on a case by case basis.
So, to clarify, "Moving Quickly" in the 10th rank ability is refering to the actions of an attack, and not movement? But in Fast Stealth, "move" is refering to a move action?
Fast Stealth wrote: This ability allows a rogue to move at
full speed using the Stealth skill without penalty.
Could you clarify a bit, Mark?
So is the 10th rank ability really meant to be read as:
10 Ranks: Stealth check penalties for the following are
halved:
-Sniping, including the effects of 5 ranks.
-moving at full speed while using stealth
-using bluff to stealth.
Because as written, it is unclear if sniping would benefit from fast stealth, or how that would even work.
So, at 5 ranks, stealth works as normal, except that your stealth check to maintain stealth after sniping is at a -10 instead of the normal -20.
At 10 ranks, stealth works as normal, except that the following stealth penalties are halved:
ability unlocked at 5 ranks: Sniping, penalty now -5
moving full speed: penalty now -3 (used to be -5).
reaching concealment after creating a distraction: normally a -10 penalty, is now -5.
The Fast Stealth talent specifically deals with move speed, eliminating the normal -5 penalty, making it 0. It does nothing for sniping, or getting to concealment during a distraction.
The issue I see is a very unclear use of the term 'move'.
For example, reaching concealment:
Quote: Being Observed: If people are observing you using any of their senses (but typically sight), you can't use Stealth. Against most creatures, finding cover or concealment allows you to use Stealth. If your observers are momentarily distracted (such as by a Bluff check), you can attempt to use Stealth. While the others turn their attention from you, you can attempt a Stealth check if you can get to an unobserved place of some kind. This check, however, is made at a –10 penalty because you have to move fast.
The -10 to Stealth is due to 'moving fast.' Fast Stealth specifically removes penalties from moving at full speed. So unless 'moving fast' is something defined elsewhere, I can't see a reason that Fast Stealth would not negate that penalty.
Sniping is worded differently:
Sniping wrote: If you've already successfully used Stealth at least 10 feet from your target, you can make one ranged attack and then immediately use Stealth again. You take a –20 penalty on your Stealth check to maintain your obscured location.[...]Sniping is a move action. There is no mention of movement in Sniping, but the Skill Unlock ability calls that into question. If Sniping is like Reaching Concealment, then similar logic would apply related to Fast Stealth.
But like I said, its all down to the word 'move' having about 3 different meanings here.
'move' and 'speed' are specific terms though, that have to do with moving from one square to another, as in a move action. 'full speed' is a move action that uses your 'full' move, 30 ft for humans, etc.
'move fast' in all of these rules, are just flavor text, either describing, or justifying, but not specifically classifying a particular action that in any way lines up with any other particular action.
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