Beast shape:
Medium animal: If the form you take is that of a Medium animal, you gain a +2 size bonus to your Strength and a +2 natural armor bonus.
lets say i am a level 8 druid and can wild shape for 24 hours/day. If i have 11 STR base, and wildshape into a medium bear, i gain +2 STR, as a temperary bonus.
Temperary bonus's become permanent after 24 hours
(Permanent Bonuses: Ability bonuses with a duration greater than 1 day actually increase the relevant ability score after 24 hours. Modify all skills and statistics as appropriate. This might cause you to gain skill points, hit points, and other bonuses. These bonuses should be noted separately in case they are removed. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/basics-ability-scores/ability-scores)
I wildshape for 2 continuous days. after the first day i have a STR of 13, permanent.
Do i qualify for power attack as a feat while wildshaped?
(prerequisite STR 13)
First, you are not wild shaped for 24hours per day. You are wild shaped three times for 8 hours each with a round in between. Thus, your strength bonus never becomes permanent.
Second, while not written in the rules, the Devs have indicated that if you qualify for a feat part time then you should be able to take the feat but you can only use it (and any feats based on that feat) while you qualify for it.
This allows feats like Improved Natural Attack to be taken if you polymorph into a creature with a natural attack.
First, you are not wild shaped for 24hours per day. You are wild shaped three times for 8 hours each with a round in between. Thus, your strength bonus never becomes permanent.
Second, while not written in the rules, the Devs have indicated that if you qualify for a feat part time then you should be able to take the feat but you can only use it (and any feats based on that feat) while you qualify for it.
This allows feats like Improved Natural Attack to be taken if you polymorph into a creature with a natural attack.
I dont know if i agree with your first statement.
before my wildshape ends i wildshape again into a different medium creature providing the same +2 STR bonus. If i keep this up how have i not been wildshaped for 24 hours making it a permanent bonus?Could you possibly link to the second point (dispute with gm so would like to show him?
Thanks
Ok, if you wildshape before your wildshape ends you have the same result, 2 rounds short of a full 24hours. Unless you are level 9 of course. :)
Links: link1 link2 link3 link4
Basically, in most of them SKR discusses the idea that the prerequisite should be a prerequisite to use the feat, not to take it. However, in Link4 he got an official word (I didn't remember it) which states that temporary ability score bonuses do not count for pre-requisites. But the concept that you qualify part time for other things like Hover, INA, etc still applies.
Ok, if you wildshape before your wildshape ends you have the same result, 2 rounds short of a full 24hours. Unless you are level 9 of course. :)
Links: link1 link2 link3 link4
Basically, in most of them SKR discusses the idea that the prerequisite should be a prerequisite to use the feat, not to take it. However, in Link4 he got an official word (I didn't remember it) which states that temporary ability score bonuses do not count for pre-requisites. But the concept that you qualify part time for other things like Hover, INA, etc still applies.
I agree about needing to be lvl 9 to do it now. I will have a look at the links you posted. Thanks for the feedback
Ok, if you wildshape before your wildshape ends you have the same result, 2 rounds short of a full 24hours. Unless you are level 9 of course. :)
Links: link1 link2 link3 link4
Basically, in most of them SKR discusses the idea that the prerequisite should be a prerequisite to use the feat, not to take it. However, in Link4 he got an official word (I didn't remember it) which states that temporary ability score bonuses do not count for pre-requisites. But the concept that you qualify part time for other things like Hover, INA, etc still applies.
So by raw i cannot take it without having a belt or some such. But by SKR's RAI i could take it t lvl 1 if i wanted?
Am i understanding correctly?
Basically, in order to qualify to take a feat that has an Ability Score prerequisite you must be able to meet the ability score prerequisite with a permanent score. Temporary scores are inadequate.
After that if your score drops low enough that you would not qualify then you lose access to the feat but not actually lose the feat.
What is more confusing is that after SKR's comments three temporary ability score FAQs came out that basically stated that temporary ability score bonuses should count for whatever permanent bonuses count for (except for uses per day type numbers).
SKR's statements regarding when you can take a feat were his personal statements.
However, since he made those comments the Dev team has moved in the same direction via the retraining rules and FAQ. Using the retraining rules you can retrain early level feats for feats that you could not have qualified for at those early levels.
Example: The retraining rules allow you to retrain "Iron Will" (just to pick a random feat) with a feat that has a BAB requirement higher than +1 (such as, Improved Critical).
What you and your GM wants to make of these FAQs/comments is up to you guys but my take is that if you have access to the prerequisite (even part time, maybe even temporary) you should be able to take the feat but you will not be able to use it unless you qualify at the moment you want to use it.
We play it with the you can take it but only use it part time ruling. Also because they worry about this more: Synthesist Summoners.
Do i qualify for power attack as a feat while wildshaped?
(prerequisite STR 13)
I look at it the same way they treat the fly skill. "You cannot take this skill without a natural means of flight or gliding. Creatures can also take ranks in Fly if they possess a reliable means of flying every day (either through a spell or other magical manner, such as a druid’s wild shape ability).
So for me, as long as you have a reliable means of gaining the prerequisite every day, you can use it for the prerequisite while using that reliable means. This allows draconic sorcerers, barbarians with the correct powers and wildshapers to take feats for their claws.
As far as needing an ability to be 'permanent', I only require that for items that grant abilities. This is purely for balance reasons so people don't juggle items between them for things like extra spell slots.
Now I know you're wondering what the official stance is and there you wander into a grey area. Gauss covers it pretty well. At the very worst if your DM requires a 'permanent' stat, ask how much it is to rent a belt of strength for 2 days then take the feat. Give back the belt and you still have the feat.