NotEspi's Headhunt

[NotEspi]

Hello, everyone!

This is a preliminary discussion thread for the playtest game you likely have information about. If you are not sure, you probably shouldn't be here. Think of it a s a session zero thread. Not to worry, there will be an actual gameplay thread for this. I just don't know what it will be called yet. I don't like to name threads 'Placeholder name number seven', so waiting for that tone consensus (see below).

I would like to start the actual game by Tuesday.

Anyway, the character creation rules are as follows:

- standard ability scores
- starting level 5
- free archetype - yes
- ancestral paragon - no
- automatic bonus progression - yes
- 50 gp per character and extra 120 gp for characters that are not able to get runes for their primary offensive capabilities

Regarding free archetype, probably stick to the common stuff. If someone really wants something weird, run it by me. I'm okay with talking about it.

We are doing a War of Immortals playtest, and we have at least one class from that playtest (Animist), so stuff might get weird. Just putting that out there. There is still a slot for an Exemplar character, if someone wants to run that.

Since this is a playtest, I will want to have at least a few encounters done by the end of September, so I (and potentially, yourselves) can participate in the survey.

With that said, I would like to keep a steady pace of at least one post per day. We need to go fast, since playtest has a deadline, but that does not mean we are pulling the plug on October 1st.

The game itself will be - not sure yet. That is why I need some info from you. We will essentially do a oneshot, kind of.

So everyone, please let me know what kind of game you are up for here, tone-wise. We can do something lighthearted, something darker (within reason), something epic-ish (you're level 5, no tarrasque for you), something absurd, I don't know. Let me know what you want to play, and I will try to make something up.

Setting - Golarion. We are probably all familiar with it, to an extent, and there's no need to reinvent the wheel, especially since we are on a bit of a timeline.

Right. So - most of you know me, some of you don't. I am Espi (he/him, if that info helps you), I have been playing and running PF tables for a while now. 10-12 years, or so. I don't have the specific date. In any case, I am currently on a WFH setup and ready to do this thing.

So let's get ready. Please let me know what kind of game you are looking for here. As soon as possible. Once we have a consensus, I will put my gray matter to work and make a first post. Then we can go.

So welcome, and let's roll some dice and have fun.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Hi.

[BretI]

Hello!

[Lanni Talimbi]

I'm pretty open to most anything - within reason.

Sundered Waves looks amusing. It would certainly fit with my story from my previous game. Not sure how long it is though.

Are you looking to homebrew stuff after we run out of published content? Or instead of published content?

[BretI]

Kind of game: I tend to like investigation and/or whimsical adventures. Something that had a mixture of skills challenges, social interactions and combat. I am fine if there is no combat, but that probably isn’t a good idea since this is partially a playtest.

Setting Impossible Lands and River Kingdoms tend to be fun. I am not a big fan of Ustalov or Cheliax. Mana Wastes can be fun but might interfere with playtest results.

Character type I am pretty open on this. We probably should have at least one Exemplar and it probably wouldn’t be bad to have two of the same playtest character types, but I am fine taking a normal class.

[Hilary Moon Murphy]

Light hearted and absurd sound great to me. And what Bret said for type of adventure.

[NotEspi]

Lanni Talimbi wrote:

Are you looking to homebrew stuff after we run out of published content? Or instead of published content?

Well it's technically not homebrew, since we are sticking to official rules and setting, but we are not doing published adventures. I will likely make it up on the fly. With some basic premise in mind.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Nice. Nothing but surprises.

[Lanni Talimbi]

And yes, a good mix of combat, skill challenges, and social challenges would be great.

[NotEspi]

Anything you specifically DO NOT WANT in the game? People might have lines in the sand, so I would like to know about those. I forgot to ask in the first post.

[BretI]

I don’t tend to like horror and can get bored if everything is combat to the death.

I really liked the mechanism for surrender they put into Struck by Shadows.

[NotEspi]

BretI wrote:

I don’t tend to like horror and can get bored if everything is combat to the death.

I really liked the mechanism for surrender they put into Struck by Shadows.

I don't own that. Can you give me a quick rundown of the mechanic?

[feyrial]

I deleted my posts - I was going to play but upon reflection it isn't going to be high enough of a priority on my to-do list for me to feel good about taking a spot - I'm really behind in work stuff and have been dealing with medical stuff that makes me slow to post.

[NotEspi]

I spoke to feyrial and decided to keep a slot open until she has some time. Until then, there are 5 of us.

Note I usually do pretty sandboxy games with the players driving the plot, but with me gently nudging towards a plot arch that might seem relevant. I will have hooks for you, if you are not sure what you want to do, but just thought you should know. In case you want to make characters work towards something specific.

After I have collected info from everyone about the game preferences, I will drop a basic premise. I already know that your characters will be at least familiar with each other, so no need to worry about that. As a matter of fact, I may just do an in medias res start, depending on what we agree on as a collective. This is, after all, a collaborative storytelling activity.

[Lanni Talimbi]

I have my character pretty much ready to go. Which was easy because it was an existing character from a previous game that crashed and burned. But it is now updated to 2e and the new Animist class.

So as people start getting ideas for characters, let us know so that we can better plan things. We can play off of each other at that point.

I had to look up what in medias res means. But I like the idea.

[BretI]

I also had to look the term up.

Does this mean we will potentially be making use of flashbacks? I don’t mind and can think of at least one case with an SFS adventure where the flashbacks worked really well. In that case it was present the problem and then flashback to what you had done to prepare for the problem.

[NotEspi]

Re:Flashbacks - Potentially. Since we are starting with level 5, it presents an opportunity to fill in (back)story elements for the overall plot and players.

It doesn't mean we are starting at the end of an arc. In this case, it might mean the first post is 'in the middle of' an encounter (social, combat or otherwise) with an established goal. The goal here could be whatever, depending on the planned plot and character plans.

But since we are kind of rushing the game, I understand you (and me, as well) will not have much time to do establishing scenes (briefing, traveling to the starting scene, what have you) and it could give us space to fill in those blanks.

As an example, it could mean that the first post is an initiative roll with a conflict to resolve. Could.

I honestly consider combat to be the least interesting part of RPGs, but we ARE doing a playtest here, so that's where I am coming from with this idea.

Re:Characters - this is not a published scenario. I will try to tailor the game to the party composition as best as I can. Make characters that you want to have fun with. Odd stuff you wouldn't have a chance to play otherwise or want to try in a level 5 oneshot, etc.

With that said, I would like to establish the premise of the game/plot tomorrow, so if you could all give me the preferences, it would make my life easier in the long run.

Characters completed by monday.

Game starting by tuesday.

I know it's a tight schedule, and we can change/partially recton things in the first week or so if you are not happy with what you brought to the table.

[Chuck8]

Lighthearted with action works for me.

[BretI]

NotEspi wrote:

As an example, it could mean that the first post is an initiative roll with a conflict to resolve. Could.

That has worked for a number of Bond films, no reason we couldn’t do it here.

I don’t have a character yet. Hearing what others are bringing will help me decide on what my character is.

I know we have a halfling animist. Does anyone else know what they want to bring?

[NotEspi]

Right. So so far we have these:

Investigation and/or whimsical adventures - Bretl
Light hearted and absurd - Hmm
Lighthearted with action - Chuck8

Going by the majority, based on the list above, I think I have a plan.

I will be going for a an investigation/mystery on the lighter side of things. No world-ending horror.

I have a concept in mind. A localised issue in a medium-sized settlement that acts as a ruling body for the immediate area. This means there will be some mayor or nobleman/noblewoman and their mansion, surrounded by small businesses and farms, and potentially one or two larger companies that have a foothold in the area (or trying to gain influence). There will be a few temples here as well - I am thinking of Erastil, Pharasma, and a few others. No large cathedrals. As a matter of fact, potentially just altars. One or two of these will be larger than the others. Thinking of Erastil and Pharasma here.

I will go with the River Kingdoms for the setting.

You all would be freelancers or adventurers for hire working with an organisation (not unlike an adventurer guild) hired to investigate the issue.

I will drop further details later today, but the above should give you a rough idea of the where and how you got there, so you can start making them toons.

Looking forward to what you are bringing!

[Lanni Talimbi]

The plan and concept sounds good to me.

Feyrial was the only one who was in-game with Lanni previously. So to give a brief presentation of the character:

Lanni is a wanderer at heart. I am using the Free Spirit background to represent that. He can be quite a prankster at times, but he keeps it under control with his friends.

And he has a lot of friends. Most of them not living. But he tries to make friends with the living just as much. Previously as a Medium I would switch out which spirit Lanni is connecting to every day. I plan to do similar with Animist, though now I get three of them - but only one is primary at a time.

The spirits that Lanni is associating with that day can have a noticeable influence over his attitudes on certain things. Once, through a choice of spirit association and an unfortunate twist of fate, he was very much trying to light a signal fire that was on Bonewrack Isle - a small island deep in pirate territory. His living friends had to physically restrain him at one point, and for the rest of the day he was still trying to light on fire anything he could find. All of that was done with above-table discussion with the rest of the players in the group. I'm not going to surprise people with possibly disruptive things like that.

Speaking of spirits - or rather speaking to spirits - I don't like having silent abilities. I can, and will, go on rants about it.

Silent Abilities rant:

Silent abilities are a bit of a bane to play-by-post IMHO.

I was reading a campaign (I wasn't in it, but some of the others in our play group were) and there was a character who had some strange parallel universe things going on. But it all happened very briefly and entirely in her own vision and mind. So it was some fantastic creative writing - that no one else in the group could interact with.

I am currently in a game with a Summoner. With their telepathic connection to their Eidolon we again end up with some really good dialog between these two halves of the character - that none of the rest of us can interact with.

So... for my Medium/Animist I created a symbol

:⁂:

to represent in-text a facial expression of 'listening to someone that the rest of you can't hear'. So when you see that, realize that you very much can react to that in-character in-game.

[BretI]

Plan sounds good to me as well.

[NotEspi]

If there are spoiler free questions for me, shoot. Any time.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Do you have any strong feeling on Earth's Bile?

I don't think the spell itself is out of line if it is just used like any other focus spell.

It does seem to be a bit broken if I am allowed to stack three instances of it on the same area on round 1 of combat.

[NotEspi]

Playtest classes can (and should) be played RAW. That is, after all, the point.

If the text allows you to do it, I'm not stopping you, but I will mention any such interactions in the survey.

However, for intents and purposes of keeping the enjoyment, using cheese repeatedly may earn my ire, and a warning.

As a matter of fact, I would recommend that anyone playing an animist or exemplar actively looks for the cheese and points it out in the game... ONCE per cheese found.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Sample the cheese. Don't make it the main course. Got it.

[NotEspi]

That's the spirit!

[BretI]

NotEspi wrote:

BretI wrote:

I don’t tend to like horror and can get bored if everything is combat to the death.

I really liked the mechanism for surrender they put into Struck by Shadows.

I don't own that. Can you give me a quick rundown of the mechanic?

I somehow missed this question earlier.

They added a new action type that they used for less than fanatical followers. You could break their morale.

——

APPEAL TO SHADOWY INTRUDERS [two-actions]
UNCOMMON AUDITORY CONCENTRATE LINGUISTIC MENTAL

Requirements A [RED-ACTED] sneak you can see is visibly shaken, such as by being reduced to half of their maximum Hit Points or fewer.

You call out to a visibly shaken foe and attempt to convince them to surrender. Depending upon your strategy, attempt a Deception, Diplomacy, or Intimidation check against the foe's Will DC to make your case for the foe's surrender.

Critical Success The foe is quick to surrender and attempts to convince their allies to surrender as well. You and your allies gain a +1 circumstance bonus to checks to Appeal to Shadowy Intruders for 1 minute.

Success The foe takes your words to heart and surrenders to you immediately.

Failure The foe brushes off your attempt and continues to fight.

Critical Failure Your argument is severely flawed or laughable. The foe disregards your words and continues to fight. You take a –1 circumstance penalty to checks to Appeal to Shadowy Intruders for 1 minute.

——

From a game master point of view, this is nice because it is only opponents you define as susceptible to such negotiations. Those are generally not going to be the main plot characters.

From a player point of view, a lot of people like getting a chance to use their Charisma skills to end parts of the battle a little earlier. Two actions generally isn’t enough to one-shot an injured foe, so it also pays off in terms of action economy. Turn a combatant into a non-combatant that you can later question.

I think it works really well for mercenaries. In the scenario this comes from, it was badly treated ‘expendable grunts’ in a fight.

To partially quote the scenario: ‘Given the opportunity, many of these [RED-ACTED] prefer to slip away during the assault to live another day, rather than giving up their lives.’

Personally, I think this should become part of the base rules. There are a lot of cases where surrender should be an option for either side.

[Hilary Moon Murphy]

So how many characters do we have, and what are people bringing? I am tempted to bring my PFS investigator , Zendel (with a few more class feats do to Free Archetype.) Unless no one is bringing an exemplar. Then I may make one.

But I's like to hear more character concepts. Shall we be an entirely gnomish party?

[Zendel of Oprak]

Actually, let's just declare it. I'm bringing Zendel. He's a comfortable fit, and he's already Level 5. He just needs an ABP / Free Archetype version.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Investigator. Very nice.

[NotEspi]

If you're asking how many PLAYERS - after feyrial decided to not join us (at least for now?), there are 5 players on the roster. Well - all players are mostly present, with phaeton_nz missing.

Lanni told me he reached out to phaeton, but not sure regarding the response. So that leaves us with FOUR players currently contributing to the thread.

Which is good enough for me. If feyrial or phaeton decide to join in at a later date, I am fine with it.

As for CHARACTERS - well, I didn't see any outside of this thread, so there's two of you. I will get to work on an introductory post today and hopefully post it. If not, tomorrow, as that is the day I was hoping to actually start. But I have some doubts on that front. We'll see if you can prove me wrong.

I have a thing in my head. Just need to translate that into text. I will put down a link here when it's posted.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Yeah. I sent PM, but haven't gotten any response.

[BretI]

Gnome Animist, Gnome Investigator.

Let’s go for an all small party. I’ll build some sort of gnome as well. I’m going to try to read through the exemplar, see if I can find anything that interests me. Otherwise it will be some sort of front liner.

[BretI]

@NotEspi,

Would you allow the Tamchal Chakram or the rope dart as a weapon? They are both Uncommon weapons with Thrown and Finesse on them.

If not, I can use a regular dagger. It being a simple weapon would give me the dice increase.

[Chuck8]

Thinking of going with a Tengu Rogue for this one

[Lanni Talimbi]

Sounds good. You may end up feeling like you are herding cats, lol.

[NotEspi]

BretI wrote:

@NotEspi,

Would you allow the Tamchal Chakram or the rope dart as a weapon? They are both Uncommon weapons with Thrown and Finesse on them.

If not, I can use a regular dagger. It being a simple weapon would give me the dice increase.

If you burn a feat on proficiency/unconventional weaponry, sure.

[Hilary Moon Murphy]

Is there a Gameplay we can dot into?

[BretI]

NotEspi wrote:

BretI wrote:

@NotEspi,

Would you allow the Tamchal Chakram or the rope dart as a weapon? They are both Uncommon weapons with Thrown and Finesse on them.

If not, I can use a regular dagger. It being a simple weapon would give me the dice increase.

If you burn a feat on proficiency/unconventional weaponry, sure.

I will just use a dagger then.

[Lanni Talimbi]

Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Is there a Gameplay we can dot into?

Probably by what we would call morning.

[NotEspi]

Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Is there a Gameplay we can dot into?

Not just yet. 6 am for me right now. I'll transition into the productive part of the day and carry on with the writing. Let's say I'll have it ready in some 5-6 hrs?

BretI wrote:

NotEspi wrote:

BretI wrote:

@NotEspi,

Would you allow the Tamchal Chakram or the rope dart as a weapon? They are both Uncommon weapons with Thrown and Finesse on them.

If not, I can use a regular dagger. It being a simple weapon would give me the dice increase.

If you burn a feat on proficiency/unconventional weaponry, sure.

I will just use a dagger then.

Let me specify - it's not the uncommon tag that bothers me here. If you have martial prof / advanced prof somehow, grab them.

[NotEspi]

here you go

https://paizo.com/campaigns/v5748p75ivn25/gameplay&page=last

Viridian Brigade is the name of the adventurer guild that hired you. You may call yourselves whatever you wish.

[Colonel Tipper]

Still working out the details of the character, but I will be bringing a dagger wielding gnome.

[GM NotEspi]

If you are bringing an exemplar, rope dart is martial. You can go with that.

[Colonel Tipper]

Dagger d4 simple turns into d6. It is also agile.

Rope dart d4 martial stays d4. Sweep with multiple opponents only partially makes up for not being agile. Disarm is not very useful.

Trip is nice, but probably not worth it.

Having looked at it, dagger is probably better than the rope dart.

Still working on the character.

[Colonel Tipper]

Having looked at it, I’m not sure that dagger will work that well either. Afraid that I’m going to need a little more time with this build. It isn’t coming together quite like I want it to.

Are we allowed to use the alternate racial of two bumps instead of the standard adjustments for the ancestry?

[Lanni Talimbi]

Colonel Tipper wrote:

Having looked at it, I’m not sure that dagger will work that well either. Afraid that I’m going to need a little more time with this build. It isn’t coming together quite like I want it to.

Are we allowed to use the alternate racial of two bumps instead of the standard adjustments for the ancestry?

I thought that was standard.

I sure hope it is allowed since I'm pretty sure I used it.

[GM NotEspi]

Okay, I guess I will look over your characters sheets to check if they are legal after all? I assumed I could trust you with this.

I originally meant ability score generation including the ability flaws from ancestries, but I guess we could do both.

We are NOT doing point buy or rolling. Just putting that out there.

[Lanni Talimbi]

GM NotEspi wrote:

Okay, I guess I will look over your characters sheets to check if they are legal after all? I assumed I could trust you with this.

I originally meant ability score generation including the ability flaws from ancestries, but I guess we could do both.

We are NOT doing point buy or rolling. Just putting that out there.

Yeah, I wasn't expecting to use variant rules other than the ones you listed.

But 'two free ancestry boosts' isn't a variant rule.

Since I couldn't build this on Pathbuilder or something like that, I put a level-by-level build choices block in my profile. At the very bottom.