I was reading about the chainsaw and I have a question.
If I do not use a charge, how much damage does it do? I'm thinking improvised weapon. Maybe 1d6 or 2d6 like a great sword? And the damage should be bludgeoning. Crit on 20?
Should I get the -4 penalty to attack for using it as an improvised weapon? I have the exotic feat to wield the thing and the technique doesn't change much. I do not think I should get the penalty even if it is not supposed to be used like that. The lower damage and crit should be enough.
Suggestions?
This is the rules forum.
Actually, this is the rules questions forum.
By the rules, you do the damage and damage type the GM says is appropriate.
I thought I did the damage the books said it should do.
Yes, you take a -4 penalty for an improvised weapon. The only thing that removes this is Catch Off Guard or something else that removes the penalty for using improvised weapons. Exotic feat means nothing. And if you, the player, know how to fight with a running chainsaw... we may need to call the police.
Check again. The chainsaw is an exotic weapon. PF Techonology Guide or the SRD link in the OP.
If the chain is not being moved, it won't cause damage.
Or do bludgeoning damage. ;)
Please tell me what damage a chainsaw used as an improvised weapon does. Page numbers, quote, whatever you have handy.
This is why I'm asking the community for some advice. So far ou haven't given anything constructive. ;-)
The fact that it's an exotic weapon doesn't mean exotic weapon proficiency prevents you from taking penalties for using it as an improvised weapon.
Maybe I should have been clearer. It isn't an improvised weapon if the engine doesn't work. It is still a weapon that is still wielded like a sword to hit (but now the damage is bludgeoning). It is not like that chair you just picked up to hit the orc.
if you're not using a charge it's not a weapon.
Sure it is. It doesn't stop being a weapon.
Did you have anything useful to contribute to this discussion? You could try reading to OP to figure out what it's actually about.
lol!
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Although bob bob bob is being snarky, he is 100% correct. If you want to use the chainsaw as per the book stats, you need to consume a charge per hour. If you are not, you cannot use the chainsaw as written at all. However, you can use anything as an improvised weapon, given the DM agrees and you take the -4 penalty (and do only the d6-d8 or so damage a large improvised weapon would do). Thus, this is your only option when the chainsaw is 'off'.
if you're not using a charge it's not a weapon.Sure it is. It doesn't stop being a weapon.
Actually, I am pretty sure it does stop being a weapon. Technological items do not function without charge, so the chainsaw would do nothing. You would have to use it as an improvised weapon at that point, the same as if I had a Laser Rifle with no charge--I don't get to shoot it anyway for lesser damage or something.
So, Bob Bob Bob is correct: it would deal whatever damage the GM felt, as per the improvised weapon rules.
Although bob bob bob is being snarky, he is 100% correct. If you want to use the chainsaw as per the book stats, you need to consume a charge per hour. If you are not, you cannot use the chainsaw as written at all. However, you can use anything as an improvised weapon, given the DM agrees and you take the -4 penalty (and do only the d6-d8 or so damage a large improvised weapon would do). Thus, this is your only option when the chainsaw is 'off'.
How did you come up with 1d6-1d8?
if you're not using a charge it's not a weapon.Sure it is. It doesn't stop being a weapon.Actually, I am pretty sure it does stop being a weapon. Technological items do not function without charge, so the chainsaw would do nothing. You would have to use it as an improvised weapon at that point, the same as if I had a Laser Rifle with no charge--I don't get to shoot it anyway for lesser damage or something.
So, Bob Bob Bob is correct: it would deal whatever damage the GM felt, as per the improvised weapon rules.
It still a weapon even withut charges. It is not like it become a kitchen utensil.
Heck, I can even enchant it with magic weapon.
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if you're not using a charge it's not a weapon.Sure it is. It doesn't stop being a weapon.Actually, I am pretty sure it does stop being a weapon. Technological items do not function without charge, so the chainsaw would do nothing. You would have to use it as an improvised weapon at that point, the same as if I had a Laser Rifle with no charge--I don't get to shoot it anyway for lesser damage or something.
So, Bob Bob Bob is correct: it would deal whatever damage the GM felt, as per the improvised weapon rules.
It still a weapon even withut charges. It is not like it become a kitchen utensil.
Heck, I can even enchant it with magic weapon.
Yep, and my heavy crossbow with no bolts is also a weapon and can totally be enchanted. How much damage does it do when I attack with it when I have no bolts?
When you use a weapon wrong, it uses none of its stats, you can only use it as an improvised weapon.
Although bob bob bob is being snarky, he is 100% correct. If you want to use the chainsaw as per the book stats, you need to consume a charge per hour. If you are not, you cannot use the chainsaw as written at all. However, you can use anything as an improvised weapon, given the DM agrees and you take the -4 penalty (and do only the d6-d8 or so damage a large improvised weapon would do). Thus, this is your only option when the chainsaw is 'off'.How did you come up with 1d6-1d8?
Improvised Weapons
Sometimes objects not crafted to be weapons nonetheless see use in combat. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses an improvised weapon in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with that object. To determine the size category and appropriate damage for an improvised weapon, compare its relative size and damage potential to the weapon list to find a reasonable match. An improvised weapon scores a threat on a natural roll of 20 and deals double damage on a critical hit. An improvised thrown weapon has a range increment of 10 feet.
Although bob bob bob is being snarky, he is 100% correct. If you want to use the chainsaw as per the book stats, you need to consume a charge per hour. If you are not, you cannot use the chainsaw as written at all. However, you can use anything as an improvised weapon, given the DM agrees and you take the -4 penalty (and do only the d6-d8 or so damage a large improvised weapon would do). Thus, this is your only option when the chainsaw is 'off'.How did you come up with 1d6-1d8?Improvised Weapons
Sometimes objects not crafted to be weapons nonetheless see use in combat. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses an improvised weapon in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with that object. To determine the size category and appropriate damage for an improvised weapon, compare its relative size and damage potential to the weapon list to find a reasonable match. An improvised weapon scores a threat on a natural roll of 20 and deals double damage on a critical hit. An improvised thrown weapon has a range increment of 10 feet.
There is the rub. Why can't it be compared to a great sword or bastard sword?
There is the rub. Why can't it be compared to a great sword or bastard sword?Although bob bob bob is being snarky, he is 100% correct. If you want to use the chainsaw as per the book stats, you need to consume a charge per hour. If you are not, you cannot use the chainsaw as written at all. However, you can use anything as an improvised weapon, given the DM agrees and you take the -4 penalty (and do only the d6-d8 or so damage a large improvised weapon would do). Thus, this is your only option when the chainsaw is 'off'.How did you come up with 1d6-1d8?Improvised Weapons
Sometimes objects not crafted to be weapons nonetheless see use in combat. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses an improvised weapon in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with that object. To determine the size category and appropriate damage for an improvised weapon, compare its relative size and damage potential to the weapon list to find a reasonable match. An improvised weapon scores a threat on a natural roll of 20 and deals double damage on a critical hit. An improvised thrown weapon has a range increment of 10 feet.
It can, if you've never seen a greatsword or bastard sword ;)
Chainsaws are shaped really poorly for use as actual swinging around weapons. All the wait is at the base, and there's a not especially sharp, somewhat flimsy (for real combat) psuedo-blade. I feel like you'd be better off with thick gloves turning the thing around and hitting people with the handle.
If you tried to improvise with a Chainsaw in my game, I'd probably err on the side of making it better than it should be and call it a greatclub.
So, no penalty if it is like a great club.
Cool, thanks!
So, no penalty if it is like a great club.
Cool, thanks!
Er, no, it would be a -4 to hit for being an improvised weapon, but I, personally, would treat it as a greatclub for damage (so, 1d10/x2).
It'd really depend on the construction, since they range from "sleek, almost delicate" ones to some pretty bulky builds. I could see as low as d4 to as high as a d8 depending on that chainsaw's build. I'd also say B or S.
For images, check out the new AP. The inside back cover of Lords of Rust has a good pic and description. The front cover has one with a very solid construction.
Greatclub is pretty generous, imo. I'd probably lean towards Heavy Mace or Light Mace, given the size of a chainsaw and the weight when swung in combat.
Great club is extremely generous. 1d8 is the outer/best case scenario if you are going to use it as an improvised weapon. It isn't shaped to swing heavy end at an opponent like a great club. It has all the heavy parts on the side you are holding to maneuver it.
Yeah, like I said, I was figuring you'd turn it around and whack them with the heavy bit.
But then, I also thought I remembered Greatclubs as 2d4 simple weapons, not 1d10 martial, so, just consider that recommendation redacted.
This is the rules forum.Actually, this is the rules questions forum.
It's like Sparta with less kicking, more screaming, and roughly equal amounts of bloodshed.
-Skeld
I suggest this: Sparduh!
Ever tried to use a fuel-less chainsaw as a weapon irl before? Ok neither have I, but it would be completely useless as a weapon. The tree branch on the ground you just cut off would be more effective.
I've never tried to use a large great vorpal sword to behead a great wyrm gold dragon either. Have you?
I'm basing my great sword comparison to this pic. Seems like a bludgeoning great sword to me when the engine is not on.
Using the engine side I would say 1d8. Using the other(chain) end I would say 1d4, but either way is a -4 penalty.