Do animal type specific things affect dire animals?

[Scythia]

If an ability, spell, or magic item specifies that it works on a particular animal type, does it only work on the regular animals of that type, or does it also work on dire animals of that type?

For example:
If an ability says it allows you to speak with rats, can you speak with a dire rat?
If a magic item does extra damage against bears, would it do extra damage against a dire bear?
If a spell let you see what a wolf sees, could you cast it on a dire wolf?

[Weirdo]

I think it should also affect dire animals.

[Scythia]

Weirdo wrote:

I think it should also affect dire animals.

That's what I'm inclined to think as well, I'm just curious to hear if that's a common view.

[dragonhunterq]

I'd be interested in the argument as to how a dire rat isn't actually a rat.

Unlike in 3.5 dire animals no longer have the 'beast' type that was about the only rules basis I could think of to treat them differently.

[That Crazy Alchemist]

Dire Animals still have the Animal Type. It was 3.5 that made that distinction, making them Magical Beasts. So you're all good.

[Chemlak]

Hmmm... Goblin dog? Text says it's a rodent, name says dog.

But I agree, dire animals are still animals of their specific type.

[Paladin of Baha-who?]

A dire wolf is a type of wolf. A dire bear is a type of bear. I can't see any reasonable GM arguing otherwise. (Note: GMs are often unreasonable.)

[blackbloodtroll]

Chemlak wrote:

Hmmm... Goblin dog? Text says it's a rodent, name says dog.

But I agree, dire animals are still animals of their specific type.

Goblin Dogs are just dogs, the same way Prairie Dogs, are dogs.

[blahpers]

If they didn't, animal shaman druids would be poor(er) options.

[Weirdo]

Actual evidence, in addition to common sense:

Bear, Grizzly and Bear, Dire are both listed under the index "Bear" on the prd (and also in the Bestiary, p 31).

Compare Goblin Dog which is listed on its own (Bestiary p 157) and not under Dog, Goblin.

[blahpers]

I would count goblin dog as a rodent. Goblins hate dogs.

[Paladin of Baha-who?]

There's no spells that affect only one type of animal such as rodents, as far as I know.

[Avoron]

Goblin dogs are not dogs any more than sea lions are lions. They are a completely different type of animal.

Incidentally, ratfolk get a bonus on Handle Animal checks to influence rodents.

[Val'bryn2]

As long as it's still the animal type, it should by all reasonable standards work. Interestingly, since a goblin dog is a rodent, the ratfolk bonus on checks vs rodents works on goblin dogs.

[Scythia]

Thanks for the responses everyone, I'm glad to see affirmation of my assumption.

[Scythia]

Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:

There's no spells that affect only one type of animal such as rodents, as far as I know.

A caster could always research one. Maybe a witch who's fond of vexing towns with rat infestations could develop a rat specific variant of Speak With Animals that would grant bonuses to checks made to persuade them.

The specific ability that this question came up in reference to was the Dhamphir racial trait that allows them to speak with bats, rats, and wolves.