Runestone of Power

[Epsilon]

Do you need to hold a runestone of power to use it, or can I leave it in my backpack and still use it.

Advanced Class Guide:
A runestone of power is a small chip of polished stone etched
with a rune. These objects are potent aids to all spellcasters
who cast spontaneously (but not to spellcasters like clerics
who have the option to spontaneously cast certain spells).
Once per day, a spontaneous caster can draw upon a
runestone of power to cast a spell—doing so is part of the
spellcasting action, and expends that runestone’s power for
the day rather than one of the spellcaster’s actual spell slots
for the day. An expended runestone of power recharges its
capacity after 24 hours. The spell must be of a particular
level, depending on the runestone.

It seems unclear to me whether you need to be holding it or it can just be used as long as its on your person.
If I can use it regardless of where it is can it also be used if it was in a bag of holding or handy haversack?

[That Crazy Alchemist]

"As part of the spellcasting action" would indicate that it should be used as a spell focus and all that that implies.

[Dafydd]

I agree, looks like it is intended to be an additional focus. That said, the focus rules say nothing about how a focus must be used.

[That Crazy Alchemist]

It's generally accepted that a focus is nothing more than a material component that you don't expend when the spell is cast. So retrieval from a component pouch is a free action as part of casting, and then a move to stow it or a free to drop it.

[Epsilon]

It doesn't say it's used as a focus. It recharges after 24 hours. It also say draw upon a runestone of power. It used as part of a spellcasting action, which at least to me implies that the person just needs to be carrying it for it to be used.

[That Crazy Alchemist]

If you can come up with even a single instance in which someone can use something as "part of spellcasting" without actually having that thing in his hand then I might agree with you. But otherwise since every instance in this game that involves using something as part of spellcasting requires it to be in your hand it would be safe to guess it is handled that way rather than as an unusual special case.

[Epsilon]

I would completely agree with you its that text though about draw upon that is bothering me.

[That Crazy Alchemist]

True, I could see that. But as "draw upon" has no direct correlation to any rules within the game where as at least "as part of the spellcasting action" does, it's best to handle it like a focus.
It makes more sense too, think of every movie or video game where the BBEG "drew upon" a power source (one small enough to be held that is). He always held it up high ceremoniously as the power flew through him, or aimed it at the good guy as he shot some nasty energy beam at him, or at least had some kind of physical contact. It was never in his backpack lol.

[Abrir]

it probably meant to work exactly like a orb/stone of power 1, though i'm not sure what the rule for that is either.

[Dolanar]

Aren't Divine Foci that are tattoos used as part of spellcasting? They do not have to be held.

[Weirdo]

That Crazy Alchemist wrote:

It's generally accepted that a focus is nothing more than a material component that you don't expend when the spell is cast. So retrieval from a component pouch is a free action as part of casting, and then a move to stow it or a free to drop it.

Wait, you're supposed to take a move action to put your focus back in the pack? My group always assumed that stowing the focus, like drawing it, is considered part of the spellcasting action.

[Epsilon]

It's probably GM discretion how they want to handle that part.

[Dafydd]

Most Holy symbols are worn around the neck. Some are tattooed onto your flesh, somewhere.

There are 2 examples Alchemist.

[Akerlof]

Dafydd wrote:

Most Holy symbols are worn around the neck. Some are tattooed onto your flesh, somewhere.

There are 2 examples Alchemist.

There's nothing in the rules to indicate that a Divine Focus works any differently than an arcane Focus component:

Focus/Divine Focus wrote:

Components
A spell's components explain what you must do or possess to cast the spell. The components entry in a spell description includes abbreviations that tell you what type of components it requires. Specifics for material and focus components are given at the end of the descriptive text. Usually you don't need to worry about components, but when you can't use a component for some reason or when a material or focus component is expensive, then the components are important.

...

Focus (F): A focus component is a prop of some sort. Unlike a material component, a focus is not consumed when the spell is cast and can be reused. As with material components, the cost for a focus is negligible unless a price is given. Assume that focus components of negligible cost are in your spell component pouch.

Divine Focus (DF): A divine focus component is an item of spiritual significance. The divine focus for a cleric or a paladin is a holy symbol appropriate to the character's faith. The divine focus for a druid or a ranger is a sprig of holly, or some other sacred plant.

If the Components line includes F/DF or M/DF, the arcane version of the spell has a focus component or a material component (the abbreviation before the slash) and the divine version has a divine focus component (the abbreviation after the slash).

Tattoo holy symbols have specific rules, and those rules include something more than simply having them on your body to function:

"The tattoo must be fully visible to use it in this way (it cannot be covered with a glove, gauntlet, or any other material)."

So, yeah, unless there's specific wording otherwise I would treat Runestones of Power as any other spell focus. (And it's about time they reprinted them! The Pathfinder Society Field Guide is too obscure for something so basic.)

[That Crazy Alchemist]

Weirdo wrote:

That Crazy Alchemist wrote:

It's generally accepted that a focus is nothing more than a material component that you don't expend when the spell is cast. So retrieval from a component pouch is a free action as part of casting, and then a move to stow it or a free to drop it.

Wait, you're supposed to take a move action to put your focus back in the pack? My group always assumed that stowing the focus, like drawing it, is considered part of the spellcasting action.

Yep, you can pull it out for free but stowing it technically requires a move action, though a lot of GM's (me included) wave this as it's kinda micromanaging.

Dafydd wrote:

Most Holy symbols are worn around the neck.

Never said you can't wear the rune around your neck but this item, just like a holy symbol, will still need to be grabbed hold of in order to use it just like any other kind of focus.

Come to think of it, this is a good way to solve the first problem above. Just wear the rune around your neck, that way you don't need to use a move to stow it after using it.

[Weirdo]

That Crazy Alchemist wrote:

Yep, you can pull it out for free but stowing it technically requires a move action, though a lot of GM's (me included) wave this as it's kinda micromanaging.

Do you have a citation for that? The only thing I can find is "Unless these [material] components are elaborate, preparing them is a free action" and while you're right that replacing a focus isn't strictly "preparing" unless there's something explicitly saying you need to stow a focus separately I think it's pretty clear that material components and focuses are not intended to require extra actions.

That Crazy Alchemist wrote:

Dafydd wrote:

Most Holy symbols are worn around the neck.

Never said you can't wear the rune around your neck but this item, just like a holy symbol, will still need to be grabbed hold of in order to use it just like any other kind of focus.

Come to think of it, this is a good way to solve the first problem above. Just wear the rune around your neck, that way you don't need to use a move to stow it after using it.

That would be a decent work-around.

[Epsilon]

But then what if you had multiple runestones? Or is it Make a necklace of runestones, and you touch the corresponding one when you cast it?