RE: Teamwork Feat are awesome

[Flawed]

So the more I read teamwork feats the more I laugh maniacally at their power. Obviously it seems hard to justify in some builds, but in others it seems too much to not try it out.

Feint Partner + Improved Feint Partner:

Requires that party members take combat reflexes and have BAB +6. Any time an ally feints an enemy you threaten you get an AoO.

Scenario: (4 players, p1, p2, p3, p4. Whole team having Improved Feint Partner. One person is higher dex for lots of AoO potential and pumps single hit damage and others have improved feint maybe one person goes crazy and gets moonlight stalker feint as well.)

p1.(Basher) charges
P2. move action feint, standard action feint
p3. move action feint, standard action feint
p4. move action feint, standard action feint, swift action feint

p1. 7 AoO's in one round + charge attack.

7 could be high for AoO's so you spread it round and have 2 guys charge and then each of them gets 5 AoOs each for 10 AoO total + 2 charge attacks. 3 charges + 9 AoO's. All in a single round of combat.

Even just looking at the applications of having 2 players using this makes TWFeint become even more devastating combination by giving up your best attack to feint and giving it to your ally and then getting your full attack followed by your ally providing the same to you. A couple rogues/ninja's/sneak attack class with this would become very powerful vs. things they could feint.

Broken Wing Gambit:

You give a bonus to enemies who attack you, but doing so provokes from your allies.

Scenario: 4 man party with this feat descend upon a creature each hitting and allowing the creature the bonus. Regardless of the ally that gets attacked everyone gets an AoO which equates to 4 charges + 3 AoO's before a monster gets a swing off. Coupled with most other styles this feat for front liners should aid in getting lots more AoO's.

Escape Route:

Move through squares adjacent to allies without provoking AoO's.

Scenario: 3 or 4 allies with this ability can freely flank any creature without fear of provoking by moving through adjacent squares.

Mount + rider with this = move anywhere without provoking.

Makes the withdraw action look like a joke and combat positioning very simple.

Seize the Moment + Butterfly's Sting:

Seize the moment gives a free attack when allies crit and butterfly's sting lets you give a crit to an ally.

Scenario: 2 players with Seize the Moment. One is a high crit modifier weapon and the other a high crit range weapon with butterfly's sting.

p1. confirms critical hit and allows the next ally to hit auto confirm a crit.
p2. AoO from the first confirmed crit which if it hits is an auto crit and then full attacks.
p1. AoO from p2 crit.

So with one guy confirming a crit he gave an AoO which is an auto crit which gives an AoO. One hit(crit passed on) + One AoO Crit + One AoO.

Obviously this one has prerequisites with higher BAB so it comes together later.

Shield Wall:

A free +2 Shield bonus to AC as long as you're adjacent to an ally.

Target of Opportunity:

As an immediate action you get an attack if an ally hits an enemy within 30 feet of you with an arrow. 2 Archers = free attack per round.

Paired Opportunists:

+4 bonus on AoO's.

With all the AoO's you can get why not go for the +4 with all of them.

Stealth Synergy:

Take the highest roll of anyone that has this feat.

Increase your success with stealth by rolling as many dice as you have party members. Obviously niche if you have a party of stealthy individuals, but amazing if you do.

Lookout:

Act in surprise round if ally can.

Got an ally with an ability to go in the surprise round? Take this and your whole party gets it.

Coordinated Charge:

Charge when an ally does.

Now your initiative doesn't matter if you have an ally with a good modifier you can all charge when they do.

4 man party:

Rogue (Bandit) Moonlight Feint line + Improved Feint
Sohei Monk
Paladin
Bard

Teamwork feats: Lookout, Feint Partner, Improved Feint Partner, Broken Wing Gambit, Coordinated Charge

Party always acts in a surprise round. Everyone can charge the same target at the same time if its in range. Bard holds charge and uses inspire courage, Rogue holds back and uses swift action feint, move action feint, standard action feint.

[Michael Sayre]

Yeah, if you have a build that allows you to use them reliably like an Inquisitor with Solo Tactics or a Hunter and her pet, they're pretty much the best feats you can get.

[Flawed]

I do think Solo Tactics is amazing and having a pet makes this easier to pull off as well for sure. I just feel like some of them are completely worth it regardless. Like Broken Wing gambit. As long as your strategy is to take on creatures together then you can get a free AoO every round. The more people with it the more AoO's go around. Same with the Improved Feint Partner. It's almost worth building around combat reflexes and this as you can reliably give a lot of AoO's in a single turn. There's even a feat that lets you feint 2 people as a standard action or as a move if you have Improved Feint. Some set ups will be very feat intensive and require a class like fighter or rogue to pull off which I can understand, but you could have a fighter who uses a swift action feint, move action to feint 2 people, standard action to feint 2 people giving 5 AoO's in a single turn or more depending on who's around each creature. This has applications for many caster classes as well if you can spare the skills to be good at feinting and don't mind using a move action to feint. If you can provide 2 AoO's from two decent damage dealers it's worth spending the move action on it and then dropping a spell to clean up. Escape route is almost a no brainer for any melee focused group if you really wanted to wade into the enemy.

Feint partner can also go well with Combat Patrol if the person has enough movement and a reach weapon or natural reach(Monk with a long spear and the Aberrant Eldritch Heritage could hit a 35 foot radius with 90 feet of movement to get around stabbing people that get feinted. Potentially hand out AoO's and move with the guy on patrol as he pushes people around.

[rainzax]

swift action feint?

[Flawed]

Moonlight Stalker Feint is very feat intensive to get. If you want anything else with it it's pretty much a fighter deal which was why I mentioned the fighter doing it. A rogue can pull it off too with the right talents and Inquisitors should be able to do it as well.

[Umbranus]

Flawed wrote:

Moonlight Stalker Feint is very feat intensive to get. If you want anything else with it it's pretty much a fighter deal which was why I mentioned the fighter doing it. A rogue can pull it off too with the right talents and Inquisitors should be able to do it as well.

A reliable way to get moonlight stalker going is the arcane bloodrager with constant blur while raging from level 4 on. Add in fighter levels after level 4 to get bonus feats.

Edit: About the OP: Teamwork feats can be strong if you build for it. But why not? If a group uses tactics and works in concert they are stronger than their parts.
Most groups I played in, or GMed for, were just a band of individuals.

[Mergy]

Pack Flanking is a nice one from the ACG. If you and your ally are threatening a target, you're flanking them. Combine with Outflank and a menacing weapon for a net +6 when you and an ally gang up.

[Snorter]

I just want to be sure this works as listed

Seize the Moment + Butterfly's Sting: wrote:

Seize the moment gives a free attack when allies crit and butterfly's sting lets you give a crit to an ally.

Scenario: 2 players with Seize the Moment. One is a high crit modifier weapon and the other a high crit range weapon with butterfly's sting.

p1. confirms critical hit and allows the next ally to hit auto confirm a crit.
p2. AoO from the first confirmed crit which if it hits is an auto crit and then full attacks.
p1. AoO from p2 crit.

So with one guy confirming a crit he gave an AoO which is an auto crit which gives an AoO. One hit(crit passed on) + One AoO Crit + One AoO.

Obviously this one has prerequisites with higher BAB so it comes together later.

Since to use Butterfly's Sting, you 'forgo the effect of the critical hit', would that prevent the ally from also benefitting from the free AoO?

You confirm it, true. But then you refuse it, to give your ally the benefits of a crit if they hit.
Does the refusal to accept your own confirmed crit, mean your ally can't count it as a confirm for the AoO?
IE, They have to use their normal attacks, and hope for a hit to be increased to a crit.

The second part should still work, if P2 hits, auto-crits, and passes back an AoO to P1.