Retraining Rules Question

[Moveenar]

I have run into a situation in PFS that I'm unsure of how to resolve. Here is the summary version:

Level 1 - Character is a human witch. With the class hex they select Cackle. They then take extra hex twice selecting Evil Eye and Misfortune.

Level 2 - Character takes one class level of Shaman and selects Chant as their hex.

After acquiring enough prestige (I'm unsure if it would be 5 or 7 for PFS), the character wants to retrain the first level of Witch into Shaman.

Where I am stumped is what happens to the two extra hex feats the character took at first level. As a witch this would be legal but Shaman do not get the hex class feature until level two.

The character is maintaining that since they are now a level two Shaman and have access to Hex at level two that they should be able to keep the extra hexes as shaman hexes.

Is this correct or should something else happen to those feats spent at first level? If it is correct, it is a very clever way to speed up hex progression for a shaman by spending prestige.

Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.

[Jeraa]

I believe the other player is correct.

Quote:

When you retrain a class level, you lose all the benefits of the highest level you have in that class. You immediately select a different class, add a level in that class, and gain all the benefits of that new class level.

This retraining does not allow you to reselect the feats your character gains at odd levels or the ability score increases your character gains every four levels (though you can retrain those options separately). If retraining a class level means you no longer qualify for a feat, prestige class, or other ability you have, you can't use that feat, prestige class, or ability until you meet the qualifications again. (You can still retrain that feat, prestige class, or other ability.)

You still have all feats you had before, even if you couldn't use them. So as long as he has the Hex class feature from somewhere (which he does from the Shaman levels), he is fine and can uses those hexes he gained from the feats.

Though unless I am missing something, he can't take Chant as his shaman hex. Not until he retrains his witch level into a shaman level. Shamans don't get hexes until 2nd level.

[cartmanbeck]

Yep... that's actually super smart on the player's part. Might have to steal that idea for a future character... though I've already got 19 characters so I need to stop making new ones. LOL

[Pupsocket]

Retraining allows you to make characters that could not have been made without retraining. You can retrain your 1. level feat into a feat you didn't qualify for at 1. level.

During the retraining procedure, he loses his with level, and no longer qualifies for extra hex. The rules state that this means he can't sue the feat until he qualifies, not that he loses it. Then he gains a shamn level, and he now qualifies for the feats he has and can use them without problems.

[Moveenar]

Okay - thanks for the quick responses.

So essentially once the character retrains the first level of Witch into Shaman and since they took Shaman as their second level class, they would then get the ability to pick up any hex they wanted now that they are a second level Shaman...essentially giving them Evil Eye, Misfortune, and Chant (if they so chose) as a second level shaman.

I couldn't find anything, but has Shaman been giving a retraining synergy with Witch so that it will only cost 5 Prestige in PFS?

Thanks again for all the help.

[Sammy T]

From the PFS blog for this week:

Quote:

What are the warpriest's retraining synergies (as per Ultimate Campaign's retraining rules on page 190)?
In Pathfinder Society Organized Play, determine the retraining synergies for the Advanced Class Guide classes by substituting one class name for an existing class on the table. For example, an arcanist has the same retraining synergies as a wizard, and any class that lists the wizard as a retraining synergy also has the arcanist as a retraining synergy.

Substitute the term "arcanist" anywhere the term "wizard" appears.
Substitute the term "bloodrager" anywhere the term "barbarian" appears. Bloodragers have retraining synergy with sorcerers and vice versa.
Substitute the term "brawler" anywhere the term "fighter" appears.
Substitute the term "hunter" anywhere the term "ranger" appears.
Substitute the term "investigator" anywhere the term "alchemist" appears.
Substitute the term "shaman" anywhere the term "druid" appears.
Substitute the term "skald" anywhere the term "bard" appears. Skalds have retraining synergy with barbarians and vice versa.
Substitute the term "slayer" anywhere the term "ranger" appears. Slayers have retraining synergy with rogues and vice versa.
Substitute the term "swashbuckler" anywhere the term "fighter" appears.
Substitute the term "warpriest" anywhere the term "paladin" appears.

[Moveenar]

Good catch Sammy T

It's too bad Shaman don't receive a synergy with either parent class.