Monsters attacking with two claws?

[toxicpie]

For example, the troll with "2 claws +8 (1d6+5)". Does this mean it has two separate attacks made as a full-round action, or this attack is done with two claws but is just a normal attack?

If the latter, why does the skeleton have options for " claw –3 (1d4+1) or 2 claws +2 (1d4+2)", when it is clearly always a better option to go for two claws?
And, actually, how does attacking with two claws give the skeleton an attack bonus, I would have thought the penalties would worsen, like with two-weapon fighting.

Thank you!

[Duiker]

1. Yes, those two claws only happen on a full attack. Otherwise it can only attack with one of them.

2. You're reading that stat block wrong, here it is quoted: "broken scimitar +0 (1d6), claw –3 (1d4+1) or 2 claws +2 (1d4+2)"

What that means is that it can full attack with the broken scimitar (which is one handed) and then claw with the other hand (which makes that claw a secondary natural weapon and thus -5 to its normal attack) or if it doesn't have the scimitar out, it can attack with both claws.

[Redneckdevil]

Brain dead on the first one. Nvm the troll one u roll twice
skeleton i can explain. The -3 for a single claw is what the stats are if the skeleton uses a weapon along with it. Its a natural attack so it goes off highest bab for all of them. When u are using a weapon, the natural attack becomes secondary and has a -5 to highest bab to it.
two weapon fighting dont apply to natural attacks.

[Bob Bob Bob]

If you have more than one attack, from natural attacks, iterative attacks, two-weapon fighting, whatever, you must always use a full round action full attack to get them, unless you have an exception.

Like the others said, the troll has 2 claw attacks, it can claw with one as a standard or both as a full attack.

Again, like the others said, you just parsed the skeleton wrong. It's "one scimitar and one claw" or "two claws", but again, only on a full attack.

[toxicpie]

Oohhhhh I see, thanks, guys!!

So the troll would have to use bite when there's no opportunity for a full-round action? Which is stronger anyway.

Also, how do you calculate the troll's attack with one claw, if it's possible?

[Eridan]

Natural Attacks wrote:

Natural Attacks Most creatures possess one or more natural attacks (attacks made without a weapon). These attacks fall into one of two categories, primary and secondary attacks. Primary attacks are made using the creature's full base attack bonus and add the creature's full Strength bonus on damage rolls. Secondary attacks are made using the creature's base attack bonus –5 and add only 1/2 the creature's Strength bonus on damage rolls. If a creature has only one natural attack, it is always made using the creature's full base attack bonus and adds 1-1/2 times the creature's Strength bonus on damage rolls. This increase does not apply if the creature has multiple attacks but only takes one. If a creature has only one type of attack, but has multiple attacks per round, that attack is treated as a primary attack, regardless of its type.

Claws and bites are primary attacks. So all combinations of natural attacks are done with full or -5 attack bonus depending on the natural weapon you use. There are no penalties for offhand attacks, iterative attacks (you dont get them with nat. weapons) etc.

In your example the troll will always attack with his full attack bonus. It doesnt matter what attack he uses because all his attacks are primary attacks. For a single attack the bite is a little better due to the higher damage dice.

[Bob Bob Bob]

If the troll uses just one claw you just... well, roll what you did for two claws, but only once. So +8 to attack and 1d6+5 damage.

[toxicpie]

Sorry, just realised how stupid I've been!

Two claws is +8 to attack and 1d6+5 damage, then again, +8 to attack and 1d6+5 damage. Two attacks. Right, thanks, everyone!