Ranged Sneak Attacks

[DM Swan]

How do other DM/GMs handle sneak attacks with ranged weapons? I have a player, who is a rogue, who can get within 30 feet of a target. If I, as the DM, decide the target loses his dex bonus (can't see the rogue, etc.), then I allow sneak attack damage if the rogue hits with their bow. How do others handle this????

[Scythia]

I think you're doing it correctly. Ranged sneak attack is tricky to do. Being hidden and within 30' is about the most reliable way, but staying hidden after the shot is difficult, so it's almost impossible to sneak attack on a full attack with the hidden shot technique.

Otherwise, you can ranged sneak attack while invisible, although getting more than one requires improved. Or, if you have a method to make an opponent flat footed that could work.

[ecw1701]

That's about the only way without going to 3PP, yep.

There was another thread about this very thing, too. They covered it in pretty great detail.

[Bob Bob Bob]

There are two ways a player can ranged sneak attack easily and without too much of a mess. Both are from the stealth playtest (because stealth as written was failing), which added a "Hidden" condition that make you effectively invisible to anyone you successfully stealthed against. In the stealth rules it has the rules for sniping, which are

Sniping wrote:

Sniping: If you've already successfully used Stealth at least 10 feet from your target, you can make one ranged attack and then immediately use Stealth again. You take a –20 penalty on your Stealth check to maintain your obscured location.

This lets a player stay within 30 feet of someone, shoot them, and hide again without moving (at a significant penalty).

The other option is almost the same, but involves a player shooting them, moving to cover/concealment, and making a stealth check as part of their move to hide exactly where they end up. You may also require a Bluff check from the player to create a diversion so the opponent loses sight of them.

More exotic ways involve getting obscuring mist/smokestick and a way to see through fog/smoke and hiding inside it so the player can see out and their enemies can't see in.

There's also invisibility and greater invisibility and any ranged attacks.

The magic item to help ranged sneak attacks is Sniper Goggles which let a player avoid the range limitation on it.

[Scythia]

Bob Bob Bob wrote:

More exotic ways involve getting obscuring mist/smokestick and a way to see through fog/smoke and hiding inside it so the player can see out and their enemies can't see in.

That just made me think of something: a character could cast Deeper Darkness, in the middle of a lit area, around themself, which would be ridiculously conspicuous, but since they could see out of it, and others couldn't see in, they would effectively be hidden for the purposes of sneak attack.

Squad Commander: "We're taking fire! Can anyone see the shooter?"
Grunt 1: "Maybe they're in that tree that was just engulfed in darkness?"
Grunt 2: "Maybe they are, and maybe they aren't. We can't be certain."
Squad Commander: "Dear god, it's Schroedinger's sniper!"

[Atarlost]

I think Leomund's Tiny Hut is lower level and just as obscuring.

[heliodorus04]

Scythia wrote:

Bob Bob Bob wrote:

More exotic ways involve getting obscuring mist/smokestick and a way to see through fog/smoke and hiding inside it so the player can see out and their enemies can't see in.

That just made me think of something: a character could cast Deeper Darkness, in the middle of a lit area, around themself, which would be ridiculously conspicuous, but since they could see out of it, and others couldn't see in, they would effectively be hidden for the purposes of sneak attack.

Squad Commander: "We're taking fire! Can anyone see the shooter?"
Grunt 1: "Maybe they're in that tree that was just engulfed in darkness?"
Grunt 2: "Maybe they are, and maybe they aren't. We can't be certain."
Squad Commander: "Dear god, it's Schroedinger's sniper!"

Brilliant!

[Bob Bob Bob]

Actually, if you don't use the sniping rules, they know what direction they were shot from. You still break your stealth by shooting them, so while they may not be able to find you (total concealment) you're no longer hidden from them (they know you're over there). You have to keep moving in order to restealth, otherwise they just watch for the arrow from the same spot.

Hilariously, you're still sort of right. If you cast it on yourself you can still move (and be a giant moving cloud of darkness) but since they don't know exactly which part of the darkness you're in, you still get sneak attack on them (provided your stealth beats their perception).

[Gwen Smith]

Bob Bob Bob wrote:

More exotic ways involve getting obscuring mist/smokestick and a way to see through fog/smoke and hiding inside it so the player can see out and their enemies can't see in.

There's also invisibility and greater invisibility and any ranged attacks.

The magic item to help ranged sneak attacks is Sniper Goggles which let a player avoid the range limitation on it.

The biggest problem with mist/smokestick/darkness route is that the target now has concealment, so you can't do precision damage--which is the type of damage a sneak attack deals.

The way around that is the feat Shadow Strike. Once you have that, you have a lot more options.