Actually it was stated that you can't get the same ability modifier to a check twice when noted from agile maneuvers and fury's fall for basically this same situation.
If you switch out for dex you can't use dex a second time as its considered "same source." This has already been stated by the devs.
Actually it was only stated by James, not anyone that has any control over the rules, and he was incorrect.
And the source is not the dex ability, but the feats. That was taken care of in another thread. It was shown the feats can be sources. At not time was the dex ability shown to be source or bonus of any sort.
Can you link the thread, because I tried to make a trip character about 6 months ago and still got that answer.
Actually it was stated that you can't get the same ability modifier to a check twice when noted from agile maneuvers and fury's fall for basically this same situation.
If you switch out for dex you can't use dex a second time as its considered "same source." This has already been stated by the devs.
Actually it was only stated by James, not anyone that has any control over the rules, and he was incorrect.
And the source is not the dex ability, but the feats. That was taken care of in another thread. It was shown the feats can be sources. At not time was the dex ability shown to be source or bonus of any sort.
I will see if I can find it. check back in about 5 or 10 minutes
I've seen variations on this question before (like with the Lore Warden and traits that let you use Int for skills instead of Cha or Wis), so I posted a more generalized FAQ. Hopefully we can get an answer on that.
Me posting in topic A and explaining how replacing and adding dex as a bonus are not the same thing
Feel free to read any comments in between also
Thead B on this topic happening at about the same time.
I am in this one also.
Odd, I read the linked threads and the only deviant or even semi official wording was that of james jacobs. I'm sorry but unless there's some kind of post from a dev, an faq, an errata, something that contradicts them I'm gonna have to say his posts stand.
Not that I wouldn't love for this to work *sigh* but the question I always ask myself when looking at these rules decisions stands. "Would any of my pfs gm's allow this if I showed up with such a character?"
With the fury fall + weapon finesse/agile maneuvers the answer is clear. Just about every GM I meet is going to rule this as it doesn't work, even without JJ's posts stating as such.
There are no rules supporting JJ's opinion. Everything I said is in the book, but feel free to go by what JJ said. If you take his name away and look at his arguments I don't think you would agree though.
Your PFS GM's would likely give you table variation, and in PFS I would advise avoiding combos that give table variation. That means push it up the chain to see if Mike Brock will allow it, if you really want to use the build. I know the combo is really strong, which is why some don't like it.
edit: When I said JJ was incorrect before I gave the links I was saying the rule book did not agree with him. I was not implying SKR or Jason stepped in.
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From the SRD "Scion of War: You use your Charisma modifier to adjust Initiative checks instead of your Dexterity modifier."
Noble scion does not make your initiative check a charisma check, it allows you to apply your charisma modifier instead of your dex modifier to your initiative check. A circlet of persuasion does not alter your initiative, nor does any other thing that affects your charisma check. A thing has to affect your charisma modifier in order to alter your initiative check with use of the noble scion feat.
Herolab is a great product for many reasons, one of which is vetting builds. Slap a circlet of persuasion on your character with the feat you want to use and see if Herolab alters your initiative. It doesn't.
There are quite a few things Herolab fails to adjust correctly.
For example: try Arcane Strike on any character qualifying via SLA, or purchasing armor feats via fighter bonus feats on a Lore Warden, or getting the kensai's Cunning Defense to add in correctly on certain multi-class builds.