Villain at the Garrison


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


Playing solo tonight I defeated a henchman at the Garrison and met the closing requirement. Searching the deck turned up the villain, who had escaped there.

In my understanding, I then had to banish all the other cards except the villain, despite the Garrison's When Permanently Closed text which keeps weapons and armors around. (Of course, the location wasn't closed.) This was a bummer because I would have liked to pick up the +2 Longsword.

Would it have been any different if I had fought the villain there, and he escaped elsewhere? Would I still have had to banish all the cards, or would the When Permanently Closed text have applied? I am thinking in this situation it would.


i dont have the card on hand but i do believe the card trumps the rules and as long as you are closing the location (by defeating a villian or the closing requirement) its text happens. im not sure how it interacts if the location fails to close because the villian is still around.


Yeah, unfortunately all those cards had to be banished because the location did not close because the villain was there. To be perfectly honest, I don't think any cards would have been able to stay even if you defeat a villain there. The order of operations after defeating a villain calls for banishing cards first, THEN flipping the card and triggering the "when permanently closed" effect.


In the case of finding the henchman, you did the right thing. You weren't permanently closing the location, so you couldn't activate it's "When permanently closed" power. So all the cards had to be banished once you found the villain.

If you had simply encountered and defeated the villain and he had fled, then you could have permanently closed the location and could activate the power.


Actually, yeah. I think Hawk is right. Never mind what I said.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

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csouth154 wrote:
To be perfectly honest, I don't think any cards would have been able to stay even if you defeat a villain there. The order of operations after defeating a villain calls for banishing cards first, THEN flipping the card and triggering the "when permanently closed" effect.

Clever fellow! This is in fact a tiny hole that I don't believe any players have ever pointed out before. We've closed it in Skull & Shackles:

S&S Rulebook wrote:
If you didn’t find any villains, perform the When Permanently Closed effect: First, apply any effects that say “before closing.” Then banish all of the cards from the location deck; it is now closed. Finally, apply any effects that say “on closing” and flip the location card over.

A card like Garrison would now say "Before closing, set aside any weapons and armors from this location deck. On closing, shuffle them back into this location deck."


:D

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