metamagic rods and spell slots...


Rules Questions


If you have a metamagic rod which applies to spells up to level 6, can you use it with a 6th level spell, unmodified by any metamagic feats, which you prepared in a 7th level slot?


Yes. Using a spell in a higher slot does not change the spell level.


wraithstrike wrote:
Yes. Using a spell in a higher slot does not change the spell level.

But there is a general guideline saying something along the lines of 'with metamagic, use the worse-case ruling'.

And, for example, if you have a Pearl of Power L6, it won't refresh the slot/spell if you've used a 7th level slot for a 6th level spell.

So check with your GM before assuming that he/she is using what Wraithstrike says.

I'd say it doesn't work - you're using a 7th level slot, so the Rod won't apply.

Lantern Lodge

Gilarius wrote:
wraithstrike wrote:
Yes. Using a spell in a higher slot does not change the spell level.

But there is a general guideline saying something along the lines of 'with metamagic, use the worse-case ruling'.

And, for example, if you have a Pearl of Power L6, it won't refresh the slot/spell if you've used a 7th level slot for a 6th level spell.

So check with your GM before assuming that he/she is using what Wraithstrike says.

I'd say it doesn't work - you're using a 7th level slot, so the Rod won't apply.

Yes, but worst case, it's a 6th level spell and can be used with the rod. wraithstrike is correct.

The worst case refers to situations where there is a question about the spell's level, such as when using magical lineage.

It's still a good idea to check with your GM, because right or wrong, what your GM decides goes.


Worst case for the PC. Ie it's in a 7th level slot so the rod doesn't work.

There's enough ambiguity that whichever way a GM rules it, they're right - for their game, anyway.


wraithstrike wrote:
Yes. Using a spell in a higher slot does not change the spell level.

Wraithstrike is correct. Memorizing a lower level spell in a higher level slot in no way changes the spell's level or power. You need the Heighten Spell Metamagic feat to do that.

So even if you cast a 6th level spell out of a 7th level slot your casting a 6th level spell for the purposes of that Rod.


Actually, wraithstrike's ruling makes perfect sense. Essentially, your giving up a 7th level slot to have an additional 6th level slot. You get no benefits from having the spell prepared in a higher slot (unless you apply metamagics which would change the spell's level) so it makes sense that the rod would still work on it.

Lantern Lodge

Gilarius wrote:

Worst case for the PC. Ie it's in a 7th level slot so the rod doesn't work.

There's enough ambiguity that whichever way a GM rules it, they're right - for their game, anyway.

You are creating ambiguity where there is NONE in the rules. You are confusing the level of the spell slot with the level of the spell.

Wraithstrike is correct.


I'm not asking whether a spell modified by metamagic still works with a lower-level rod, but whether a completely unmodified spell still works with the lower-level rod.

The ruling that metamagic feats use whichever level is less advantageous for the player is irrelevant, because the spell hasn't been metamagiced.


Gilarius wrote:
wraithstrike wrote:
Yes. Using a spell in a higher slot does not change the spell level.

But there is a general guideline saying something along the lines of 'with metamagic, use the worse-case ruling'.

And, for example, if you have a Pearl of Power L6, it won't refresh the slot/spell if you've used a 7th level slot for a 6th level spell.

So check with your GM before assuming that he/she is using what Wraithstrike says.

I'd say it doesn't work - you're using a 7th level slot, so the Rod won't apply.

Did you read the OP?

OP wrote:

If you have a metamagic rod which applies to spells up to level 6, can you use it with a 6th level spell, unmodified by any metamagic feats, which you prepared in a 7th level slot?


Well, that post didn't say "if you've modified a 6th level spell to make it take up a 7th level slot", just "if you've used a 7th level slot for a 6th level spell".

I think it's ambiguous-ish, although I am inclined to say that if someone's using a higher-level slot, that's already enough of a cost to impose.


If its not modified by anything the game doesn't care what slot it is in.

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