I have no intention of ever doing this, but I just carefully read this ability and had a thought
Phalanx Fighting (Ex)
At 3rd level, when a phalanx soldier wields a shield, he can use any polearm or spear of his size as a one-handed weapon.
So, if you applied a buckler, could you have a polearm or spear in each hand? I know the word wield isn't clearly defined, and people argue about it in regards to weapons, but I figure most people would argue that to wield you'd need to have the ac bonus active.
Thoughts on if this works?
So you want to wield 2 spears?
Are you wanting to TWF with these?
Honestly I'm going to go with you on this one...yes you can
Although it's really just because I can't find anyway this could be overpowered or very viable and I know if anyone says no "someone" is going to scream RAW
So a guy can have IUA, and choose to TWF at 5 and 10 feet? This in my imagination seems insanely silly. Additional -1 for attacking with the buckler arm too.
And don't forget the fear factor of holding not one...but TWO polearm weapons...supa scary
So a guy can have IUA, and choose to TWF at 5 and 10 feet? This in my imagination seems insanely silly. Additional -1 for attacking with the buckler arm too.
What's insane is that he probably wouldn't be able to hit anyone with those supa scary polearms...but beware his hip checks of fury
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So a guy can have IUA, and choose to TWF at 5 and 10 feet? This in my imagination seems insanely silly. Additional -1 for attacking with the buckler arm too.What's insane is that he probably wouldn't be able to hit anyone with those supa scary polearms...but beware his hip checks of fury
Penalties.
Also, you could already threaten 5 and 10 feat away with a Polearm and Improved Unarmed Strike.
I got a little confused with that FAQ in regards to spiked armor and TWF with a THW, but you can do IUS in tandem with a THW in TWF?
It is really a terrible idea.
Penalties, are not in your favor.
Like I said, I have no desire to do this, but maybe one day if I ever choose to run this archetype, and for some reason this is vital to my survival, then I'll know that this is a thing that works.
A chance of using this? Yeah
Of it working? Depends on what you are fighting
If your GM thinks throwing CR 1/3 stuff at your character until he is level 12 then you will probably kill all the goblins in Golarion...except for Ripnugget...he's cool
SKR says you can.I got a little confused with that FAQ in regards to spiked armor and TWF with a THW, but you can do IUS in tandem with a THW in TWF?Penalties.
Also, you could already threaten 5 and 10 feat away with a Polearm and Improved Unarmed Strike.
SKR says spiked armor too, or you saying for unarmed strikes?
Like I said, I have no desire to do this, but maybe one day if I ever choose to run this archetype, and for some reason this is vital to my survival, then I'll know that this is a thing that works.It is really a terrible idea.
Penalties, are not in your favor.
Believe me...it would be far more vital to your survival to NOT do it
@Drakkiel, a chance to hit, haha.
Believe me...it would be far more vital to your survival to NOT do itLike I said, I have no desire to do this, but maybe one day if I ever choose to run this archetype, and for some reason this is vital to my survival, then I'll know that this is a thing that works.It is really a terrible idea.
Penalties, are not in your favor.
those circumstance bonus' on intimidate though!
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SKR says spiked armor too, or you saying for unarmed strikes?SKR says you can.I got a little confused with that FAQ in regards to spiked armor and TWF with a THW, but you can do IUS in tandem with a THW in TWF?Penalties.
Also, you could already threaten 5 and 10 feat away with a Polearm and Improved Unarmed Strike.
SKR says unarmed strikes are fine.
Armor Spikes got some kind weird special treatment, and they literally used "unwritten rules" to disallow it.
Time to make this a PFS character that just swings cool wind onto the enemy, and be completely be a flavor character for RP sake. The most scary and harmless man in the world!
Use small sized polearms and twf. -6/-6
Use small sized polearms and twf. -6/-6
No reach I believe due to having a reach weapon not of your size category.
Use small sized polearms and twf. -6/-6No reach I believe due to having a reach weapon not of your size category.
Reach is a weapon special feature. Weapons size does nto effect special features,
A small creature using a reach weapon reaches the same as a medium creatue usign one.
Then what am I thinking of? Perhaps I'm thinking of if you can legally hold the weapon in your hands to wield it in combat then? Like you can'e use a fine long speak on a medium sized creature, and you're saying the the small sized on a medium sized would retain the reach? I have been mislead it seems.
@EDIT
But what about using a small sized reach weapon in one hand normally without this archetype? Could you even use the weapon even though it is considered for your size a one handed weapon now? I am pretty sure it doesn't work out.
Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.
The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder's size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all.
These are the rules for sizing weapons. A two handed weapon(all normal sized reach weapons) size one step smaller becomes a one-handed weapon. It is still has monk, brace, reach, whatever.
I got a little confused with that FAQ in regards to spiked armor and TWF with a THW, but you can do IUS in tandem with a THW in TWF?Penalties.
Also, you could already threaten 5 and 10 feat away with a Polearm and Improved Unarmed Strike.
I know it's probably pointless but according to the rules this is a no go. You could use a polearm and IUS to threaten 5+10 feet but you cannot use TWF to get extra attacks while using a two handed weapon.
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I know it's probably pointless but according to the rules this is a no go. You could use a polearm and IUS to threaten 5+10 feet but you cannot use TWF to get extra attacks while using a two handed weapon.I got a little confused with that FAQ in regards to spiked armor and TWF with a THW, but you can do IUS in tandem with a THW in TWF?Penalties.
Also, you could already threaten 5 and 10 feat away with a Polearm and Improved Unarmed Strike.
According to the written, or unwritten rules?
A two-weapon fighter using two smaller sized reach weapons at level 11, would get a -1/-1 doing a full round attack with them.
Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.
The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder's size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all.
These are the rules for sizing weapons. A two handed weapon(all normal sized reach weapons) size one step smaller becomes a one-handed weapon. It is still has monk, brace, reach, whatever.
So plainly, a -2 penalty is given for a small polearm, and it can be used in one hand and allow you to still threaten 10 feet out by a medium creature? This is a legal thing?
@Durngrun Stonebreaker, what exactly is probably pointless?
So plainly, a -2 penalty is given for a small polearm, and it can be used in one hand and allow you to still threaten 10 feet out by a medium creature? This is a legal thing?Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.
The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder's size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all.
These are the rules for sizing weapons. A two handed weapon(all normal sized reach weapons) size one step smaller becomes a one-handed weapon. It is still has monk, brace, reach, whatever.
I showed you the rules. No where is the mis sized weapon does it take the feature away. You could also could use it with a magus in spell comabt
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@Durngrun Stonebreaker, what exactly is probably pointless?
Any discussion of two weapon fighting with two handed weapons. (See bbt's post) In a nutshell, your basic character has a primary "hand" and an off-"hand." Using a two-handed weapon requires both "hands" (for bbt's sake, you can find this rule in the CRB pg 141). Two weapon fighting requires an off-"hand" with which to make your extra attacks. Now "hands" is referring to effort and not physical hands. So while you do not require a free hand to make an unarmed strike, you do require a primary or off-"hand" to make an attack.
A lot of people disagree with this ruling (and I agree that it seems unnecessary) so they claim it's an "unwritten" rule or it's contradicted in places (because everything else in Pathfinder is flawless) and just generally try to sow confusion. So usually any discussion of it leads to a lot if pointless bickering and endless back and forth. Which should start any minute now...
Maybe I was confusing something with 3.5 when I was thinking about you having to be of appropriate size with your weapon to gain the benefits of the reach quality. This is definitely something to think about.
Taking a -2, and obviously a reduction in damage for a one handed reach weapon seems like a really great option. I don't think I have ever heard of anyone doing it, and I'm surprised I've never seen someone play with something like that.
Maybe I was confusing something with 3.5 when I was thinking about you having to be of appropriate size with your weapon to gain the benefits of the reach quality. This is definitely something to think about.
Taking a -2, and obviously a reduction in damage for a one handed reach weapon seems like a really great option. I don't think I have ever heard of anyone doing it, and I'm surprised I've never seen someone play with something like that.
The damage reduction is minor. The penalty to hit is pretty huge.
Although using the same weapon weapon focus and spec pays off double.
Get two fauchards so you can crit on a 15 or higher and be a cirt machine.
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I have no intention of ever doing this, but I just carefully read this ability and had a thought
Phalanx Fighting (Ex)
At 3rd level, when a phalanx soldier wields a shield, he can use any polearm or spear of his size as a one-handed weapon.
So, if you applied a buckler, could you have a polearm or spear in each hand? I know the word wield isn't clearly defined, and people argue about it in regards to weapons, but I figure most people would argue that to wield you'd need to have the ac bonus active.
Thoughts on if this works?
You aren't wielding a shield if you are only wearing it and not using it for the AC. You are wearing it. SKR explained the difference.
I see why you have problem with GMs, Rapanui.
One thing worth noting:
If you are a tiny creature (possibly by playing a small character with reduce person cast on you) you need reach to threaten adjacent squares. So these kinds of discussions are important if you plan on being tiny.
Peet
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One thing worth noting:
If you are a tiny creature (possibly by playing a small character with reduce person cast on you) you need reach to threaten adjacent squares. So these kinds of discussions are important if you plan on being tiny.
Peet
Reach Weapons: Glaives, guisarmes, lances, longspears, ranseurs, and whips are reach weapons. A reach weapon is a melee weapon that allows its wielder to strike at targets that aren't adjacent to him. Most reach weapons double the wielder's natural reach, meaning that a typical Small or Medium wielder of such a weapon can attack a creature 10 feet away, but not a creature in an adjacent square. A typical Large character wielding a reach weapon of the appropriate size can attack a creature 15 or 20 feet away, but not adjacent creatures or creatures up to 10 feet away.
Following that, most reach weapons will no help you. 0' doubled is still 0.
You need a weapon that add at least 5' to your reach instead of doubling it.
I have no intention of ever doing this, but I just carefully read this ability and had a thought
Phalanx Fighting (Ex)
At 3rd level, when a phalanx soldier wields a shield, he can use any polearm or spear of his size as a one-handed weapon.
So, if you applied a buckler, could you have a polearm or spear in each hand? I know the word wield isn't clearly defined, and people argue about it in regards to weapons, but I figure most people would argue that to wield you'd need to have the ac bonus active.
Thoughts on if this works?
You aren't wielding a shield if you are only wearing it and not using it for the AC. You are wearing it. SKR explained the difference.
I see why you have problem with GMs, Rapanui.
In that case he could probably take a couple of alchemist levels and grow an extra arm for wielding the shield in?
I can already imagine such a character using a tower shield and two polearms, he wouldn't even be able to hit the side of a barn, but it would certainly look scary.|
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You aren't wielding a shield if you are only wearing it and not using it for the AC. You are wearing it. SKR explained the difference.
I see why you have problem with GMs, Rapanui.
Bucklers are not weapons.
Where is this weird explanation of how Buckler work by SKR?
It has been cited to you a few times. I know that you don't like it , but it is very clear:
Wielding means "actively trying to use the item," and is normally only used in the context of weapons or weapon-like objects such as rods, wands, and so on.
Otherwise, it's just an item you're holding/carrying.
And if you're not holding/carrying/bearing it, you're probably wearing it, or it's stowed in a sheath or backpack.
And if you're not wielding, holding/carrying/bearing, or wearing the item, it's probably unattended.
If you're wielding a sword, you're trying to hit people with it.
If you're holding or carrying a sword, you just have it on your person, perhaps because your fighter buddy dropped it and you didn't want him to lose it.
You probably can't wear a sword.
If you're not wielding the sword, holding/carrying/bearing the sword, or wearing the sword, it's on the ground.
Wile it say "is normally only used in the context of weapons or weapon-like objects ", it say very clearly "Wielding means actively trying to use the item" too.
A guy not using a buckler as he is attacking with the arm on which the buckle is strapped isn't actively trying to use it, even in the most broad interpretation of that phrase.
He will get no AC benefit during the whole round after he has attacked with a polearm held in that hand.
AFIK there are archetypes that allow you to attack with the shield and still retain the shield AC, but no archetype that allow you to attack with a different weapon held in the buckler hand and still benefit from the buckler AC bonus.
Add this thread by Human fighter: Shield Master don't care bout no penalties and you will see were he is going.
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Can you explain when the fighter I posted fails? He seems pretty legit to me
"AC 29, touch 14, flat-footed 26 (+11 armor, +3 shield, +3 Dex, +1 natural, +1 deflection)"
and
"Phalanx Fighting (Ex) Polearms and spears are one-handed if wielded along with a shield."
and
"Melee +1 fauchard +13/+8 (1d10+8/15-20) and +2 fauchard +14/+9 (1d10+9/15-20)"
1) How are you going around wielding 2 fauchard and 1 shield at the same time?
Unless you have 3 arms or more you can't do that.
2) How do you get the AC bonus from the shield if you are attacking with the fauchard?
