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recently I have started to have a suspicion that I am using the familiar rules wrong.
Hit Dice: For the purpose of effects related to number of Hit Dice, use the master's character level or the familiar's normal HD total, whichever is higher.
What exactly couns as effects related to number of hit dice here?
So far I read it in the way that effectively the familiar counts as having as many hit dice as the master's level (or its own creature, if that has more HD), so when the master is level 7 for example the familiar counts as level 7 and has 4 feats, 7x its creature type's number of skill points, and the FORT and REF equal to a lvl 7 character's good base saves and WIL equal to a level 7 character's bad saves. BAB and Hit point number are both explicitly stated to work differently of course.
Also I assume that a familiar of a level 7 character gains 7 hit points from the toughness feat if it has it.
Is this correct, or do "effects related to hit dice" only include DCs of special abilities and by what kind of effects the familiar is affected, if the effect only affects creatures up to a certain number of hit dice?
Most people claim that it doesn't grant feats or skill points. This is the commonly accepted interpretation. It also sucks.
There are other questions this raises to. If it just means HD with regards to special ability/spell type effects, then what about the Aeon familiar. Does it's deflection special ability scale with it's hit dice?
Honestly, in my games I let the familiars gain feats and skill points. Otherwise you have no way to develop your little friend.
You were right to have a suspicion.
Familiars don't get any more skill points, feats, or base saves than their base creature. They get to use the master's skill ranks, and base saves in place of their own when better.
Effects related to hit dice would be DCs, and whether they are subject to things like sleep, or circle of death. Essentially your last sentence is correct.
TLO3: what deflection ability? Are you talking about the Paracletus?
Thanks for the clarification.
My witch player isn't going to like this. (or perhaps she will, since it means the familiar is easier to level up) I'll have to consider keeping it as a house rule for now
Familiars don't get any more skill points, feats, or base saves than their base creature.
Huh? Not even when their Int mofidier increases, thus granting them one more skill point per hit die?
Majuba: Yes, the Paracletus gets the void form special quality that all Aeons get which grants a scaling deflection bonus (something like +1 every 4 HD).
Familiars don't get any more skill points, feats, or base saves than their base creature. They get to use the master's skill ranks, and base saves in place of their own when better.Effects related to hit dice would be DCs, and whether they are subject to things like sleep, or circle of death. Essentially your last sentence is correct.
Correct. Familiars are not animal companion, they are not meant to fight, they are companions of a wizard, an already powerful character, and they help him in little tasks, granting him boons. Nevertheless with Improved familiar feat you can get very powerful beasts, with good SLAs and UMD possibilities. I am sure that an Imp with feats and skills of a character would be more effective than many players!
By the way, in the book of the damned vol 1 the diabolist can have an imp that works like an animal companion: impressive.
Majuba: Yes, the Paracletus gets the void form special quality that all Aeons get which grants a scaling deflection bonus (something like +1 every 4 HD).
Ah, I see it now - buried in the Creature types.
Yes, the Aeon will get the deflection bonus from increased HD.
Edit: Wow, at will sanctuary? Nice.
FYI - familiar spell-like ability caster level does not increase with HD. Despite typically being linked (but not always), there's no formal rules for increasing that (unless the monster entries specifies they are equal).
FYI - familiar spell-like ability caster level does not increase with HD. Despite typically being linked (but not always), there's no formal rules for increasing that (unless the monster entries specifies they are equal).
Caster level for SLAs is always equal to a creatures HD. The DC should also increase since SLA DCs are 10+ 1/2HD + CHA bonus.
Under the universal monster rules for SLAs.
This is what it is primarily for. Look at the Blasphemy spell. It affects creatures based on Hitdice, many spells do as well (sleep, cause fear, etc). That's what that is in reference to. Nothing else, Nothing more really. Oh and some supernatural and extraordinary ability DC's. Poison, frightful presence, etc DC's.
Spell-like ability caster level's etc, do not go up. Spell like abilities are not based on Hit Dice.
Exhibit A) - The Imp
hp 16 (3d10)
Spell-Like Abilities (CL 6th)
Constant—detect good, detect magic
At will—invisibility (self only)
1/day—augury, suggestion (DC 15)
1/week—commune (6 questions, CL 12th)
Exhibit B) An ability based on Hit dice on an imp :
Poison (Ex) Sting—injury; save Fort DC 13; frequency 1/round for 6 rounds; effect 1d2 Dex; cure 1 save. The save DC is Constitution-based, and includes a +2 racial bonus.
Saving throw DC = 10+1/2 HD + Con modifier :)
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Yeah, your witch is really not going to like this. For an example of how the developers intended it, you could look at the stat block for the iconic witch found: here.
Also, it would appear that SLAs, poisons, and the like also do not scale with the master's HD. Differing to James Jacob on this:
The rules say: "For the purpose of effects related to number of Hit Dice, use the master's character level or the familiar's normal HD total, whichever is higher."
This means that effects that target HD, such as cloudkill or circle of death or sleep, target your familiar as if it has your level in HD or its racial HD, whichever is higher. It's ACTUAL racial HD do not change at all, and thus it doesn't gain ability score boosts or new feats, nor does the DC associated with its special abilities increase.
To increase those, the familiar's actual HD need to go up. There's not really a way in game at this point to really do this, but that might change at some point.
Amen!
lemeres, James Jacobs statement would seem to conflict with the errata of the Silvanshee. They errata'd Silvanshee specifically because of the discussion where a Silvanshee's Lay on Hands got better due to the Master's HD.
If they had wanted to create a universal statement stating that special abilities do not get better based on the Masters HD they could have but instead they chose to errata only the Silvanshee's LoH.