Note that you don't need a speciffic size of shadow. You could quickdraw and drop slings (free, weightless and a weapon) and make a bunch of shadows on demand.
Are you saying a dropped sling would cause enough of a shadow to allow abilities to function, am I reading you right?
Note that you don't need a speciffic size of shadow. You could quickdraw and drop slings (free, weightless and a weapon) and make a bunch of shadows on demand.Are you saying a dropped sling would cause enough of a shadow to allow abilities to function, am I reading you right?
While silly, the ability does not state a size of shadow needed for the Shadow Dancer to hide in.
As for OPs #3, I would allow it to work in darkness, but from a strict reading of Shadow Master, it works only in Dim Light, same with Hide in Plain Sight and Shadow Jump.
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Do things really have to be written out word for word or should common sense take precedant? Give the writers a break, they cant possibly come up with every possible way someone can abuse something and if they were to try to the word count would be staggering.
They really need to change the wording of the "shadow" activated abilities...I know they did change one or two to say "an area of dim light"
This means that there should be at least a 5 ft square of dim light for the abilities to work...saying that you can throw something in the air and use the shadow it casts to fuel the ability is super cheesy and I would hats to play infer a GM that would accept it
(I make the above comment as a person that LOVES stealth characters and the shadowdancer PrC...just so u don't think its out of hate for the abilities)
To the OP
1. Shadowdancer's at 10th level get a DR 10/- while in shadows or dim lighting. If a character is wearing shadow armor would you allow that alone to great him the bonus? A player's argument is that the armor creates shadows that "blur" his movement.
This player is really misreading the rules associated with this topic, or he/she is trying to put one over on you. The rules associated with this are quite specific. The Shadow Master ability says you must be in an area of dim light, which is a defined term and definitely not granted by shadow armor.
Shadow Master (Su): At 10th level, whenever a shadowdancer is in an area of dim light, she gains DR 10/— and a +2 luck bonus on all saving throws. In addition, whenever she successfully scores a critical hit against a foe who is in an area of dim light, that foe is blinded for 1d6 rounds.
In an area of dim light, a character can see somewhat. Creatures within this area have concealment (20% miss chance in combat) from those without darkvision or the ability to see in darkness. A creature within an area of dim light can make a Stealth check to conceal itself. Areas of dim light include outside at night with a moon in the sky, bright starlight, and the area between 20 and 40 feet from a torch.
Shadow: This armor blurs the wearer whenever she tries to hide, while also dampening the sound around her, granting a +5 competence bonus on Stealth checks. The armor's armor check penalty still applies normally.
As you can see, the Shadowdancer must be in an area of dim light. Dim light is a defined term that makes things so hard to see it grants a 20% miss chance. The fluff description of shadowed armor does say it blurs your form, but only when you are using Stealth. Mechanically, all it does is grant a +5 to the Stealth skill, it certainly doesn't create an area of dim light.
2. Would you allow a character to use magic to create his own dim lighting to benefit from this?
Yes, if that magic actually creates an area of dim light. Spells such as Darkness and Deeper Darkness can do this and are acceptable methods of using magic to access your special abilities.
3. Would this work in complete darkness or just dim lighting and shadows?
Firstly, the only Shadowdancer ability that mentions shadow vs an area of dim light is their HiPS ability. All other abilities only mention dim light and even the HiPS ability first states you must be within 10' of an area of dim light, then goes on to say the Shadowdancer cannot use this ability to hide in its own shadow. There are two important things to remember about that last statement. 1) It is a hold over from the D&D 3.5 version of the game and the designers have stated it was simply a copy/paste editing error. 2) The designers have stated that the references to shadow in this and similar abilities (like Assassin HiPS) are synonymous with an area of dim light, they are the same thing. Reference this post by James Jacobs
That said, I believe RAW clearly states dim light is the only qualifying light level for Shadowdancers. The Assassin's HiPS is the same way when taking into consideration designer statements about shadow and dim light being synonymous. This may or may not have been intentional. It is possible that the intention was that they must be in "at least" dim light, however, the fluff descriptions don't seem to imply that. It seems to be RAI for the Shadowdancer that their powers only function in dim light, not darkness. However, I allow these abilities to function in darkness and every DM I have played under allow these abilities in darkness as well. For me this is mainly for two reasons. 1) I don't agree with building a PrC that only functions in one out of four light levels. Especially when that light level is one of the rarest light levels for a PC party to be operating in. 2) Making these abilities function only in dim light and not in darkness devastates the usefulness of these PrCs for any underground races and cultures. That ruling would cripple any Assassins and make Shadowdancers nearly useless in any Dwarven, Duergar, Drow, Svirfneblins or Cave Orc societies. Some of these make for the most iconic Assassins and Shadowdancers IMO and I don't like the idea of them not being able to use their abilities in over 90% of their environment. Can you imagine a Dark Elf Assassin trying to sneak into the pitch black encampment of his target deep in some cave and being completely unable to hide from his enemies because they all have darkvision and his HiPS doesn't work in darkness? I can and I think it's absurd.
4. Lastly, If a character is fighting a giant or creature that casts a large shadow. What kind of penalty, if any, would you impose if the shadowdancer is actively trying to stay within the creatures shadow to gain its special DR?
Going back to my statements above that the designers have said the entries of shadow should be taken as meaning dim light I would say, NO, these abilities don't function in a giant's shadow. Dim light is a defined term, as shown above, and unless this giant's shadow is somehow dark enough to grant a 20% miss chance and the ability to use Stealth it's not going to make the cut.
Note that you don't need a speciffic size of shadow. You could quickdraw and drop slings (free, weightless and a weapon) and make a bunch of shadows on demand.
While you are right in a way, no specific size is called out, your statement is not really accurate. Aside from HiPS, all of the Shadowdancer's dim light reliant abilities state the Shadowdancer must actually be IN an area of dim light. Now, even if a sling on the ground could create a miniscule area of dim light, you would be hard pressed to get your Small or Medium sized Shadowdancer IN that tiny shadow. Even the HiPS ability states the Shadowdancer must be within 10' of an area of dim light. If a player ever came to my table and threw some slings on the ground claiming they allowed him to use his Shadowdancer abilities I would laugh, because that is a fine joke. Then, if he was actually being serious, I would ask him to explain how exactly he imagines a sling on the ground is supposed to create dim light relative to a small or medium sized Shadowdancer. Keeping in mind:
Dim Light: In an area of dim light, a character can see somewhat. Creatures within this area have concealment (20% miss chance in combat) from those without darkvision or the ability to see in darkness. A creature within an area of dim light can make a Stealth check to conceal itself. Areas of dim light include outside at night with a moon in the sky, bright starlight, and the area between 20 and 40 feet from a torch.
1. No.
2. Yes.
3. No.
4. I'm not going to calculate positions of solar bodies depending on the time of day or complicated spread sheet calculations to determine exactly when in a round the PC is in shadow while dodging around in combat. No.