Mythic Vital Strike question

[Caramon Marjoram]

I've got a rules question about Mythic Vital Strike from the mythic book. It says you get to times all your crit times-ible damage modifiers by an amount equal to the number of dice you do. I have all three vital strike feats so I do 9d8 on vital strike with my huge greataxe, so I contend with the way the feat is written I should get a x9 multiplier. The DM ruled it uses the weapon's base non-vital strike dice to determine the multiplier, so I get x3 (base weapon dice is 3d8). I see why he would rule that way, because otherwise it would be a lot of damage.

BUT!

My counter argument is that if you were using a single die weapon, such as a longsword (1d8) that would mean it gives you a x1 damage modifier, which means it doesn't increase at all... Thus making the feat pointless and not giving ANY benefit at all! For example, a longsword mythic fighter with damage modifiers of +11 total would get x1 multiplier with Mythic Vital strike. Normal is +11 damage, mythic vital strike is 11 x 1 = 11 for +11 damage, it's the same damage. Which means NO increase and no benefit at all for taking the feat!!!

Does anyone know the OFFICIAL ruling for this???

[Thock the Bardbarian]

In the Mythic game I'm in, the GM and myself have looked at this feat and decided it to be by the total number of dice... so x9 in your example. It does say "by the number of weapon damage dice you roll for that feat." To us that means look at how many dice you pick up and roll to do the Vital Strike attack, that's the number you multiply it times.

That being said I think your GM is (understandably) worried about you doing so much damage to a single foe. Unless he throws a bunch of fodder in your way to slow you down, you could easily drop a single boss with lots of HP in one round.. in one hit by yourself even. I'd be worried about allowing it in a game I GM'd. So maybe try to come to a middle ground with him. Maybe it uses your total dice you roll but you only get to multiple your strength modifier (and not adding the magical bonus of your weapon and from any spells)?

After having put it into practice a few sessions we found it's incredibly powerful, but the (small) trade-off is you only get one attack and can't attack multiple foes within your reach if you dropped the one that only had 10 hp left. Most PC's with multiple attacks will be able to clean up and not waste all that extra damage. That being said.... being able to do hundreds of points of damage in one attack is pretty frickin' sweet and is hard not to resist.

[HopeAbandoned]

Please forgive the disagreement but the way I read this feat is such that it multiplies the variables normally multiplied on a critical hit by the value of normal, improved or greater vital strike multiplier (2x, 3x, 4x respectively)

Thus this feat would be on par with "pounce" effects (exceptions for characters whom can't multiply their damages such as percision damage) instead of being nearly twice as effective given the current scenario...

At least that's how I'd rule it.

[Chemlak]

Longsword 1d8+11

Critical 2d8+22

Vital strike 2d8+11

Critical vital strike 3d8+22

Mythic vital strike 2d8+22

Critical mythic vital strike 3d8+33

[Caramon Marjoram]

A lot of interesting viewpoints on my question, thank you for your replies! :)
Has Paizo ever given an "official" interpretation of how Mythic Vital Strike should work?

[Drakkiel]

I read it like hope does

Vital Strike (Mythic) wrote:

You can strike your foes with incredible force.

Prerequisite(s): Vital Strike.

Benefit: Whenever you use Vital Strike, Improved Vital Strike, or Greater Vital Strike, multiply the Strength bonus, magic bonus, and other bonuses that would normally be multiplied on a critical hit by the number of weapon damage dice you roll for that feat.

Extra damage from sources that wouldn't normally be multiplied on a critical hit isn't multiplied by this feat.

I read the "weapon damage dice not to mean the total of dice but the multiple that vital strike (improved and greater) use

So longsword works as above...increasing by one multiplier for each level of vital strike you have

If you have improved VS you multiply by 3 because you are rolling your weapon dice three times

Greater VS is four times because you roll your weapon dice four times

[Mojorat]

I discussed tis alot previously. My view is vital strike defines what weapon damage dice are and how many times you roll it. This keeps mythic vital strikes damage consistant accross all weapons.

Several people have insisted you muliply the fotal numbe if dice. The problem is this creates logic inconsistancies within the game. But at the end of the day its your game.

[Thock the Bardbarian]

After thinking about it more I think Hope and Chemlak are doing it the way it was intended. That basically gives it the same damage as a "full attack action" gives, without giving it a ridiculous amount of damage that the total number of dice would be. And like Mojorat said, it keeps it more consistent regardless of what weapon you're using (2d4 vs 1d8).

After talking to my GM about it, this is the new way we're going to be using it in the campaign. Hope that works for you too. But either way, I wish the language was a little easier to understand for this feat.

[blahpers]

Ugh, we just had this thread.

Play it as "multiply all the things instead of some of the things" and you'll be happy. The text is mangled enough to technically read "greatswords get double the bonuses over longswords!!1" but that's almost certainly another example of shoddy editing in a brilliant but oops-ridden book.

Play it as written if you want mythic NPCs to one-shot the heroes on a regular basis.

[Caramon Marjoram]

Thanks people! :)