What does the 2nd + to attack mean?

[Hawkwind7026]

I have a question about weapon attacks. What does the 2nd + mean on a weapon, such as long sword +8/+4? I can't find anything in the Core Rulebook about this?

[Wiggz]

Hawkwind7026 wrote:

I have a question about weapon attacks. What does the 2nd + mean on a weapon, such as long sword +8/+4? I can't find anything in the Core Rulebook about this?

It means that when that creature makes a full attack action, he gets two attacks with his longsword, one at +8 to attack, one at +4. If making a standard action attack (for instance after a move) then he just gets the single attack at his highest bonus, in this case +8.

[Wolf Munroe]

The second number should usually be 5 points lower than the first if they're representative of iterative attacks.

If a character has +6 BAB or higher, he gets a second attack at -5.
If he has +11 BAB or higher he gets a second attack at -5 and a third attack at -10.
If he has +16 BAB or higher he gets all those attacks and a fourth at -15.

So you see something like:
Melee +1 longsword +9/+4 (1d8+3/19-20)

That +9 is his first attack and the +4 is his second attack with that weapon in the full-round action. When attacking as a standard action, he just uses the +9.

That line there represents a basic character with +6 BAB, 14 STR, and a +1 weapon, with no weapon feats.

I know Wiggz explained it already, but the +8/+4 example doesn't fit for me since it's usually -5, so I wanted to point that out.

[Claxon]

I believe Wolf Munroe has correctly and adequately explained things here

[Hawkwind7026]

Thanks for the clarification! So it's kind of like 2 weapon fighting? I am just starting to play Pathfinder and really appreciate the help!

[Claxon]

No, it's nothing like two weapon fighting.

Two weapon fighting (with the proper feats) will give you additional attacks beyond those allowed by your normal BAB.

Below BAB of 6 you have only 1 normal attack. If you wield two weapons you can (with varying penalties) make an attack with a second weapon despite not having a second attack being granted by BAB. Please see the feats Two Weapon Fighting, Improved Two Weapon Fighting, and Greater Two Weapon Fighting.

[KainPen]

no it is nothing like 2 weapon fighting. two weapon fighting required two weapons, penalties to the attack rolls and half str damage on that extra off hand attack. two weapon fighting grants you and extra attack with your off hand weapon when preforming the above listed full attack iterative attacks.

example if the character listed above in Wolf Munroe post has a short sword +1 in his off hand(to keep the math simple)He can then add extra attack with that short sword(assume the character actual has two weapon fighting feat to simplify the math yet again.)

He can preform a full attack action and declare his is two weapon fighting.

he would get 1 attack from the longsword at +7 instead of +9 and a attack with short sword at +7 with the short sword, then another +2 with longsword. (you can actual swap the weapons around more then this you can start with short sword if you want and add full str damage to it and then do long sword as offhand but I think that makes for more penalties)

It would read like this giving the character a 3rd attack
+1 longsword +7/+2 (1d8+3/19-20) and +1 Short sword +7 (1d6+2/19-20)

now on a full attack with out two weapon fighting same as above the character can still use two weapon in the attack chain with out it being called two weapon fighting.

It would read like this. This is just swapping weapons around.
+1 longsword +9 (1d8+3/19-20) and +1 Short sword +4 (1d6+3/19-20)

see this FAQ
http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9onf

[Adam Daigle]

Thanks for being helpful, folks!

[TriOmegaZero]

Claxon wrote:

No, it's nothing like two weapon fighting.

It is a little like TWF. Both are abilities that grant you extra attacks when you full attack and nothing else. The requirements are different, one needing levels and the other needing a second weapon. But there are similarities.

Edit: Thanks to Lakesidefantasy for reminding me. Everyone always forgets that, mostly because no one wants to use it without the feat.

[Lakesidefantasy]

Except you don't need a feat to fight with two weapons and gain an extra attack.

(Man, the waters are getting muddy around here.)