Leaving a body to Escape conditions


Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

2 people marked this as FAQ candidate.
Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

Can a creature that inhabits another body use the ability to escape or leave that body despite that body being grappled, pinned or tied up.

Vermlek can leave a body they possess with a swift action are there conditions that can prevent this?

I was in a PFS scenario and the GM said they could, and the monster got out. I disagreed but did not make an issue of it at the table and brought up the point later. After talking to some others I realize that I might be wrong on this point and wanted to find out what the right answer is.

Grand Lodge

I don't think there's a general answer. It will depend on the creature ability and the condition.

A vermlek wears dead, mostly hollowed-out flesh like a suit and its own body is wriggly and flexible. Conditions that affect living creatures affect the demon, not the suit. However physical restraints on the body could easily allow the vermlek to slip out. I think your GM's ruling was reasonable. Another possibility might be to give it a +10 bonus to escape a grapple as if greased. In either case this would immediately get it out of a pin, bonds or manacles.


The vermlek's stat block doesn't say there are any conditions that stop it from escaping a body when it can take a swift action, so as far as PFS is concerned, there aren't.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

I guess my opinion came from the pinned condition which you have when tied up

A pinned creature is tightly bound and can take few actions. A pinned creature cannot move and is denied its Dexterity bonus. A pinned character also takes an additional –4 penalty to his Armor Class. A pinned creature is limited in the actions that it can take. A pinned creature can always attempt to free itself, usually through a combat maneuver check or Escape Artist check. A pinned creature can take verbal and mental actions, but cannot cast any spells that require a somatic or material component. A pinned character who attempts to cast a spell or use a spell-like ability must make a concentration check (DC 10 + grappler's CMB + spell level) or lose the spell. Pinned is a more severe version of grappled, and their effects do not stack.

Casting Spells while Pinned: The only spells which can be cast while grappling or pinned are those without somatic components and whose material components (if any) you have in hand. Even so, you must make a concentration check (DC 10 + the grappler's CMB + the level of the spell you're casting) or lose the spell.

I bolded the sections I thought were relevant to why I was thinking they couldn't escape. The section I italicized though may also apply to their ability to leave their host body as an attempt to free itself, though not sure if there would be an attempt if it can just leave.

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