Goblin Squad Member
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Certainly hike the prices enough to cover your costs and the risk of coming to a Settlement/Harvesting Site that's been hit hard, but keep it low enough to not be crippling, and I'll offer you a tax- or rent-free haven for life as a reward for coming out to 'help' us.
In a game like Pathfinder, gold is gone tomorrow, or sooner, but your reputation amongst the other Players is forever.
Somebody who has a reputation of being a good guy (or girl) and is known to be not only dependable but openly helpful to other players is going to have one hell of an army of people willing to back them up in turn.
By contrast, a heartless merchant who'd sell a glass of water to a child dying of thirst for everything they own might be very respected for their 'business savvy' ... but it also puts them at the top of the s*~+-list of everyone they've every screwed over, and they'd best spend a ton of that gold on hiring guards, whom hopefully won't just take the money and run when things get bad.
The problem with greedy players is that, inevitably, their partnerships don't last. Somebody will want a bigger piece of the pie, and sooner or later, somebody is gonna get shanked. And in a game like Pathfinder, where assassinations are valid and have crippling after-effects, a cartel of greedy players had best keep on getting bigger and bigger hauls, or eventually they'll start to experience 'internal friction' as the lack of loot and gold starts to take it's toll.
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Goblin Squad Member
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You'll also potentially gain some resources when you defeat monsters. Some monsters may be the only source of some resources - making those monsters essentially very valuable wandering resource nodes.How long before this quote starts showing up in at least three different threads and gets posted multiple times by Nihimon? :)
Also, the CEO just said harvesting would be not "fun" at first, probably even slow, hard and boring as hell. Who wants to bet a significant part of the crafting comunitty will see that not as a bug, but as a feature? ( as the value of the craft goods just went up!)
Crafters will be kings in this game. Book it.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Halforc: provided that the supply curve is strictly increasing with price, and the demand curve is nonincreasing with price, sufficient competition exists, and probably a few more economic assumptions, the merchant who tries to undercut the market clearing price will run out of the commodity he is selling, and their competitors will still move their entire volume at the fair price.
The person who ships all of the generators in from the next state, and sells them at cost (including transportation), plus a fair profit will sell out, and so will the person who ships them in from across the country and sells them at a much higher price (which includes the same profit margin, because the transportation costs are much higher).
The case of the glass of water can only happen if there is NOT cutthroat competition. If there is, the initial extortionate offer will be interrupted with a slightly less extortionate counteroffer, which will itself be interrupted by a still lower offer, until there does not exist an offer which is any lower but still provides any profit. Why would I pay someone 100 gold for water when there is someone next to him that would be glad to provide it for 95 gold, and someone beside him who is willing to offer it for a mere forty silver, and someone further down the line who is currently hiring a kid to go to the well with a bucket for a couple of copper?
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Goblin Squad Member
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I have been chatting with other members of Forgeholm while we adventure in the River Kingdoms, and the gathering system will be very tough in the higher levels (meaning, few players will be willing to invest all of their XPs into a pure gatherer). Dedicated gatherers will be rare and valuable, and crucial to their settlements success.
That said, there are a few things that would improve the gathering system, some of which has been mentioned elsewhere, and all of which is not part of MVP.
-make the gathering nodes less conspicuous in general and practically invisible to the untrained eye. Flowers should look like flowers, and midden piles would be a small jumble of rocks or debris, etc. There nodes would be part of the landscape, but show up once a gatherer is appropriately trained in the skill, or even a particular level of the skill.
-differentiate the types of nodes a little more. It is not a problem as a gatherer to get different results from the same node (“interesting plants” drop many different things), but the node is the same no matter what the skill, and that is pretty boring. And once you can regocnize the node from a distance the landscape is pretty boring. Make different plant nodes, different sparkly essences that appear to be leaking through the magical veil or a tear in the fabric of reality, small rock formations that blend into the hillsides, etc.
-I have mentioned the scanning system from EVE as a model for advanced gathering as well. Once a gatherer gets to (say) level 12 in a gathering skill (let’s use mining) a new skill appears as a trainable skill at the geologist, smelter, and armor and weapon smith shops. Let’s call it “Geophysics”.
So your gathering character has been a dedicated gatherer for some time and can mine a number of ores from mineral nodes, and you just trained level 12 mining. A new skill becomes available called “Geophysics” (since this is a specialty skill level 1 is pretty expensive, a few thousand XPs, and gets more expensive each level but the yields and chances of gushes goes up every level). You buy Geophysics with your banked XPs and can now scan a hex for particular rare ore site (even though you might find the node you might not be able to mine it yet if it is too fragile or toxic for your skill level). The gear needed to scan the hex might include a deployable kit similar to the kit used to extract the contents of a gusher node, but the character would spend some time examining a map, or putting sensors in the ground to detect possible rare nodes (the sensors could be magical or scientific in nature). The sensors could triangulate the location of the node, and it would be very small and inconspicuous. Once found a gathering kit may be deployed, but doing so would create a larger than normal monster infestation the surveyor would need help fighting off.
-A similar system would be used for essences, plants and midden piles. Call the extra skills “Botany” for plant nodes, “Attunement” for essences, and “Recycler” for trash.
-Later down the road an actual “Treasure Hunting” system might be introduced, which was great fun in every MMO it has been used in, and caused even skittish PvPers to venture into the wild to search for buried treasure.
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Goblin Squad Member
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A new skill becomes available called "Geophysics”
This one interests me. If nothing else, it could be a specialized "perception" skill that increases the range at which you spot nodes on your minimap. Possibly a different one for each node type, so that a dedicated miner with "Geophysics - mining" would spot mineral nodes from further away, but get no advantage on plant, essence, or trash nodes.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Too be honest I actually feel that gathering and to some extent crafting levels a little to quick in the early weeks - but meh it makes no long term difference.
As far as advanced gather skills I am personally in favor and like the ideas - however be prepared for a lot of "this game is nerfed for new players as we cannot compete with you vets" style whining on the forums :D
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Even the best equipment (especially the best equipment) requires resources that can be gathered with no training. If the price for T1 +2 weapons and armor rises significantly above the purchase cost of their refined materials, some entrepreneur(s) will start making it. Likewise if the price of the refined materials rises much above the cost of the raw materials.
I estimate that, with a fair profit all around, a fighter will be able to get a +2 weapon and armor for less than he can sell 100 combined iron and coal for (once T2 and T3 crafters are in operation, there will be plenty of dabblers who can make T1 equipment, and they will accept low margins).
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Goblin Squad Member
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I have been chatting with other members of Forgeholm while we adventure in the River Kingdoms, and the gathering system will be very tough in the higher levels (meaning, few players will be willing to invest all of their XPs into a pure gatherer). Dedicated gatherers will be rare and valuable, and crucial to their settlements success.
I think there will be some buffer time between upper harvesting and upper refining and crafting, allowing for at least a small amount of something else even when staying level with the top refiners.
Asheron's Call 2 had an interesting harvest system. You got a map for a particular type of resource and teleported to the area. You check the map in different spots and find out if you're closer or farther from the node and roughly how far away in general, and when you check close enough to the node it appears. A Surveying skill decreases the possible area and increases base yield of anything Surveyed, and specialized harvesting skill further increases yield. Similar to BAB and special attack bonus. Also the more dangerous the lands you made the map for the higher the yield (or higher Tier in a Pathfinder version)
While some parts aren't Pathfinder appropriate like the being teleported to a map area, but it was an engaging system for crafters in self-improvement. It could intertwine with Fanndis' geophysics.